What part of 50 shades is different from the BDSM community?

Cinnyree Cinnyree
Cinnyree
Related to: 
what part of 50 shades is different from the actual BDSM community? I am currently trying to learn more so I can decide if I want to indulge or not. I love the book but not because of the kink. Please enlighten me in any way you can!!!Thank you
12/13/2012
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MissMori MissMori
I'll make the disclaimer that I haven't read the books. I have gotten most of what I know about them from Jennifer Armintrout's wonderful (and often sarcastic and hilarious) blog entries:
link
She's pretty thorough, so I feel qualified to answer this!

There's a lot wrong. I'm going to ignore writing skills and stick with things that strike me as "Worst Dom Ever" territory.

To start with, Christian is just abusive. Yes, there are people involved in BDSM who are also abusive, but it's two separate things. He displays classic stalker/abusive boyfriend behavior. If you ask for some space and time to think, and a guy follows you anyway, that is not cool. And the physical part is . . . well, through most of this, she seems like it's really not her thing. Like the first time she gets spanked and doesn't really like it and seems afraid of "being hit".
Some of us pretend to resist, and some people like rough play to the point of tears and screaming and such, but that is the sort of thing you work out BEFORE getting hit.

A really good Dom may be willing to take on someone entirely new and inexperienced, which is cool. We all have to start somewhere. But a really good Dom would then work to educate that person, probably by suggesting books or introducing them to other kinky folk so they can ask lots of questions and explore their interests.

The whole thing where he wants her to sign a contract right away is silly. Not that having a contract is, but that's something a couple would be better off getting into after they've been playing for a little while, so they can see if they're a good match with similar goals and desires. Also, pushing a contract on someone as clueless as Ana is "Worst Dom Ever" territory again.

Oh, and the discussion on limits. This is something that often does happen early on. But in the book, she says "no anal" and he's all "but I WANT it!" The reason we discuss limits is, well, so your partner knows what's off limits. If I were having this discussion, and said an activity was a hard limit ("hard limit" means NO WAY as opposed to "soft limit" which means, maybe I'll try it with you sometime - we can discuss it more later) and the person I was negotiating with tried to push me right then, I'd know they were not going to respect my limits later and I'd be out the door.

Finally, I (and a lot of other people) really dislike the overall message that BDSM is something that emotionally damaged people do and need to be "healed" from. Christian is into BDSM because of his shitty childhood it seems, and cannot love, and then he is healed and is okay having non-kinky sex.

Lots of people are seriously into BDSM, to the point of living full-time relationships within it - and lots of them are emotionally stable and in love with their partners.

I hope that helps!

Also, I'll add that if you love the books but not the kink parts, there is nothing wrong with just not liking kink. There is nothing wrong with trying out kink just in the bedroom and either finding out you don't like it, or finding out you do like it but only want it to be part of sex and not your entire life.
12/13/2012
TheirPet TheirPet
I can't add anything to this, the above post is amazingly accurate. There is a huge difference between abusive relationships and healthy BDSM. I know, I've been in both an unhealthy and healthy one and let me tell you I got out of the abusive one as fast as I could. Everything should be consensual and talked about beforehand.
12/13/2012
Supervixen Supervixen
Quote:
Originally posted by MissMori
I'll make the disclaimer that I haven't read the books. I have gotten most of what I know about them from Jennifer Armintrout's wonderful (and often sarcastic and hilarious) blog entries:
link
She's pretty thorough, so I feel ... More
Great reply!

Yes, please understand that open communication and mutual respect is important in a happy and healthy relationship, and that's no different when it comes to BDSM. Good Doms are not abusive, they don't push their subs into doing things they don't want, they don't pressure them, and they don't stalk or have no respect for boundaries. When it comes to BDSM, people can really get hurt if limits and expectations aren't discussed, and if trust if not not established. People into BDSM, whether it just be a sexual preference in the bedroom or a full on lifestyle, understand this and they care enough to protect themselves and their partners from getting hurt either physically, psychologically, emotionally, or otherwise. If someone is inexperienced, then that person needs to educate themselves or seek out the guidance of a good Dom before they get into such a practice.

And yes, it's often portrayed in mainstream media that people into BDSM are either victims of abuse, that they are sick and need to be "fixed" to be "normal" or they themselves are abusive, selfish assholes. Certainly that can be true for some, but it's an unfair stereotype. I've never been the victim of abuse, I'm a friendly, easy going person with good relationships in my life, and I don't need to be "healed" or "fixed." I'm happy with who I am, and I know I'm not the only person out there who feels that way, especially since I've also known people in the BDSM world who have been victims of abuse, and have found that this lifestyle has had a healing effect on their past, and they feel more in control, satisfied, fulfilled and at peace than they ever have before. I don't appreciate vilifying BDSM.

That being said, 50 Shades of Grey is just a novel for entertainment purposes. The problem is that we live in a society that will read a book that was based on a Twilight fan fiction, and they think that it's an authority on BDSM culture and lifestyle. People need to separate entertainment from reality--they are not the same thing. Fantasize all you want, but if you're going to apply it to your real life, please, please, please, educate yourself and know what you are getting into, first.
12/13/2012
MissMori MissMori
I second Supervixen's point about NOT taking a work of fiction (even a good one!) and trying to apply it to reality.

Also that anyone who does want to try things out in real life should educate themselves. It seems that more people are trying BDSM out, and that can be great, but only if it's safe, sane, and consensual!
12/13/2012
Cinnyree Cinnyree
ok let me start this out with the fact that I could never make a lifestyle out of it. I could never be kink 24/7
ok second when he pushes the contract on her he thought she was a sub already. Christian is an asshole. It's part of the appeal of the book. Most girls(at least the ones i know) want a bad boy who is good for them or a guy they can "fix".
I was truly amazed after reading the book that a contract is a real thing. I am on my second time of reading the book. I know that after the first time i started looking at the internet and was amazed at what was actual real. I am totally with Ana, some of the stuff is fun but most of it is extreme. Do people actually get beat with a cane? Am i misunderstanding what a cane is? I think my biggest problem is her biggest problem. If you wanna beat my ass that's fine but you are not doing it because i did something wrong.
I really should go find book one and reference shit. I don't remember her saying no anal. I remember no fisting of any kind but i don't remember her saying no anal. I also don't remember Christian not allowing her to have any of her hard limits.
The stalking thing kinda goes with the fantasy of the girls i know. Stalking and super background checks are bad yet coming to my work and following me across country is sweet.

Funny enough my biggest problem with the book is Christian's constant "you are mine" shit. God i hated him the first time i read it. In the end i love the story and reading it through a second time i realize he is just an idiot but 90% of the men in my world are so...oh well.

I'm sorry if anything i said was offensive, I am just really bad at articulating my thoughts into words. Which is probably why i dont mind her lack of writing skills
12/13/2012
ASpiritedSlut ASpiritedSlut
Quote:
Originally posted by MissMori
I'll make the disclaimer that I haven't read the books. I have gotten most of what I know about them from Jennifer Armintrout's wonderful (and often sarcastic and hilarious) blog entries:
link
She's pretty thorough, so I feel ... More
This is fantastic, and says most everything I was going to say. I am in a BDSM relationship, and have been for more than a year. Prior to that, I dabbled in it. There are tons of great books that can give you more insight, and I'll be happy to point you in that direction, or answer more specific questions if you have them. But MissMori did a great job at answering your initial question.
12/13/2012
ASpiritedSlut ASpiritedSlut
Quote:
Originally posted by Cinnyree
ok let me start this out with the fact that I could never make a lifestyle out of it. I could never be kink 24/7
ok second when he pushes the contract on her he thought she was a sub already. Christian is an asshole. It's part of the appeal of ... More
Yes, people actually get beaten with canes. Often, though, they a reed canes, different than the walking cane you may be picturing. However, those could be used too, if someone wanted.

I could also never be beaten for doing something wrong, and I don't usually correct my submissive that way. But there are those who do incorporate that as part of their dynamic.
12/13/2012
Cinnyree Cinnyree
i would love a list of things to read
12/15/2012
RavenInChains RavenInChains
Well, the BDSM mantra is (most of the time) Safe, Sane, and Consensual. I recently had this very issue come across my blog (on Tumblr) so I'm going to copy and paste why 50 Shades of Grey is none of those things.

"Safe - In the first few chapters of the novel, Christian Grey tracks Ana’s cell phone to find her at a club. Takes her home when she’s drunk, changes her when she’s so intoxicated she doesn’t remember him doing so,and informs her he will be keeping tabs on her for her own benefit. This is not the behaviour of a respectable Dominant. This is the behaviour of a power hungry, abusive asshole who really can’t take no for an answer.

Sane - One of the most important parts of BDSM is aftercare. Scenes can be extremely traumatizing and intense for the submissive. Aftercare is anything from petting to cuddling to holding to sweet talking, whatever degree of gentleness a bottom would need to pull them out of “subspace”. How does Christian provide aftercare? He submits Ana to a traumatizing first time spanking experience AND THEN LEAVES. AND GETS MAD THAT SHE DIDN’T TELL HIM SHE WAS UPSET. He’s the one who should know better! That, again, is not the act of a responsible Dominant. It’s the act of a selfish abuser.

Consensual - Did I mention he undressed her when she was belligerently drunk? Tracked her phone to locate her? He also buys her a new car despite her saying no countless times. Now, consent is important for any kind of sexual activity at all. Consent means informed, consent means enthusiastic. Informed, enthusiastic consent. This is crucial in a BDSM setting. Scenes can be extremely intense, especially for the bottom. What is Christian’s form of obtaining consent? Handing Ana a contract highlighting all the things he wants to do her asshole and asking her to sign it. She was a virgin (Don’t even get me started.) who had never before been exposed to BDSM. Entering in that kind of relationship takes a gargantuan amount of trust and knowledge so you know exactly what you’re getting into. Not reading a list of kinks on a piece of paper and signing your rights to say no away. Christian didn’t offer her resources, he didn’t offer her information. He gave her an ultimatum. That is not the sort of consent a responsible Dom/me would seek from their submissive."

I hope those specific examples help a little. I'm not going to knock the book as a work of fiction and wet panties fantasy (I don't like them but people do). But they should not be taken as a guide to BDSM and I'm very worried that many women entering the lifestyle after having read them who weren't as smart as you and didn't go looking for the differences are going to get preyed upon by abusive men.
12/15/2012
Cinnyree Cinnyree
i def believe that i dont want the lifestlye...just some of the kinky fuckery
12/16/2012
Kayla&JJ ♥ Kayla&JJ ♥
Quote:
Originally posted by Cinnyree
i would love a list of things to read
SM 101
Screw the Roses, Send Me the Thorns
The New Topping/Bottoming books
12/17/2012
MissMori MissMori
Quote:
Originally posted by Cinnyree
ok let me start this out with the fact that I could never make a lifestyle out of it. I could never be kink 24/7
ok second when he pushes the contract on her he thought she was a sub already. Christian is an asshole. It's part of the appeal of ... More
I didn't think you said anything offensive in this thread at all. Plenty of people on here (me included) like answering questions, and it's better to ask then to be kept in the dark.

There's a whole spectrum of kink, from the people who have 24/7 relationships and contracts, to people who occasionally want to be tied up or spanked lightly during sex. None of it is wrong, as long as the people involved are clear on what they want and need. And lots of people like a little kink now and then. I guess one thing I think is important is that there's no rule that if, say, someone likes to be bound or spanked in the bedroom they are going to "work their way up" to 24/7. It's not a competition, and liking one thing about it doesn't mean anyone needs to get into other levels or activities - ever.

As far as canes (and anything else), yes some people do use them. I enjoy them (as mentioned, it's not a walking stick kind. Sir has a fiberglass one, several rattan ones, and is getting a leather one for Christmas.) but that said, lots of people don't. Same for any other single thing - it's all up to the people involved to decide what they do and don't want. Heck, I know people who like caning but can't stand paddling, and paddling is typically considered to be less intense.

And although some people do use impact for punishment, I'm never punished with it. That's something we just don't do, but again it's a personal choice.

I kind of get the "bad boy" attraction in theory, but it's not the type I go for. Honestly, part of what makes me personally feel so at home in my current relationship may be that during role play and such Sir can act "bad" and be really rough and demanding but I know that as a partner He is very thoughtful and kind and would never actually hurt me. So I guess there is the thrill of being with someone who can be tough and take control, but at the same time I'm always respected and loved.
12/17/2012
Total posts: 13
Unique posters: 7