Changes Needed for EdenPoints

Changes Needed for EdenPoints

 
 
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~LaUr3n~ ~LaUr3n~
Blinker and I were discussing the awesomeness and new evilness of the the EdenPoints program.

While a lot of the points make sense, some of them are having bad/unfair consequences.

The biggest problem, in our opinion, is the points for voting for contributor upgrades. This encourages people to vote when they might not normally. It is great to get people to vote, BUT not when they are voting just for the points.

Blinker and many other reviews worked hard for their votes and hence, upgrade. She told me about what she had to do and how long it took. It seems like a slap in the face for people to get voted in within a few hours that might not deserve it just yet.

We think that this should be changed. It doesn't seem fair to past reviewers and seems unethical in quite a few ways, not to mention these reviews that are coming out are lesser quality. In my opinion, people should have to graduate classes (1 or 2) before they can request to be advanced or have a minimum rating or 5.5 or higher in order to make the voting for points fair.

Thoughts? Criticism?

For those who are afraid to speak out...use the poll.
Answers (private voting - your screen name will NOT appear in the results):
20
32
5
210
16
Total votes: 283 (252 voters)
Poll is open
07/19/2010
Blinker Blinker
Thanks for posting this, Lauren! I really agree with the bit about having contributors have at least a ranking of 5.5 to be advanced. That's about my rating for when I was upgraded. More importantly, new students should sign up with mentors ASAP. Maybe there can be points awarded to basic reviewers who sign up with mentors? This incentive would get more people involved in the awesome mentor program, and it would really help the quality of reviews.
07/20/2010
Carrie Ann Carrie Ann
(EdenFantasys)
Neuron Geek already responded to another thread that mentions this (link) that they are considering removing the points for votes.
07/20/2010
bzzingbee bzzingbee
I had missed this in the other post also. I'm glad it is being considered to change that becuase I saw the same thing. I couldn't believe some of these reviews were getting votes. Some of them realllly need some work. I did vote for two people, I think, but it was because I thought they deserved it. As far as the mentor program goes, when I signed up for EF I didn't find out about it until after I had submitted my upgrade request. Maybe when people sign up there could be some kind of welcome email that has it mentioned or something? I think I would have gone that route had I know about it. It all ended up working out in the end though.
07/20/2010
~LaUr3n~ ~LaUr3n~
Quote:
Originally posted by Blinker
Thanks for posting this, Lauren! I really agree with the bit about having contributors have at least a ranking of 5.5 to be advanced. That's about my rating for when I was upgraded. More importantly, new students should sign up with mentors ASAP. ... More
I think that is part of it too. 10 points maybe for signing up. They already have that. And you are welcome!
07/20/2010
~LaUr3n~ ~LaUr3n~
Quote:
Originally posted by Carrie Ann
Neuron Geek already responded to another thread that mentions this (link) that they are considering removing the points for votes.
And what about the other suggestions though?
07/20/2010
~LaUr3n~ ~LaUr3n~
Quote:
Originally posted by bzzingbee
I had missed this in the other post also. I'm glad it is being considered to change that becuase I saw the same thing. I couldn't believe some of these reviews were getting votes. Some of them realllly need some work. I did vote for two people, I ... More
Glad to know, I'm not the only one. I'm sure many did.

I also voted for one I believe. I voted no different than I already do.

Ya know, a lot of my new students didn't know about it either until after. Maybe there should be an email sent when you sign up for eden (like a newbie newsletter) to inform them. LMAO...you just said the same thing. I read as I type and had not gotten that far yet. Great minds think alike!
07/20/2010
Carrie Ann Carrie Ann
(EdenFantasys)
Quote:
Originally posted by ~LaUr3n~
And what about the other suggestions though?
Requiring folks to take classes? I doubt, very seriously, that will happen.

It's not fair to the individuals who don't want to take a class, who don't need to.

We all had a chance to improve without being forced to have someone telling us how to do it. Everyone deserves that chance, if that's what they choose.
07/20/2010
~LaUr3n~ ~LaUr3n~
Quote:
Originally posted by Carrie Ann
Requiring folks to take classes? I doubt, very seriously, that will happen.

It's not fair to the individuals who don't want to take a class, who don't need to.

We all had a chance to improve without being forced to have someone telling ... More
That wasn't the only option. That's why we suggested OR the minimum rank for those who already have reviews rated well.
07/20/2010
Carrie Ann Carrie Ann
(EdenFantasys)
Quote:
Originally posted by ~LaUr3n~
That wasn't the only option. That's why we suggested OR the minimum rank for those who already have reviews rated well.
It can take a LOT of reviews for someone to hit that minimum rank sometimes.

Lauren, I know you're trying to be helpful but the fact is, voting is fair. No one gets to just "up and join".

It is the already advanced reviewers who are voting these people in, hence the already advanced reviewers fault that less than stellar people are also now advanced.

Changing the requirements of the basic reviewers isn't the answer.

Advanced reviewers being more responsible about voting is.
07/20/2010
Sir Sir
Quote:
Originally posted by Carrie Ann
It can take a LOT of reviews for someone to hit that minimum rank sometimes.

Lauren, I know you're trying to be helpful but the fact is, voting is fair. No one gets to just "up and join".

It is the already advanced reviewers who are ... More
I agree with your logic. Very much like "the gun didn't kill the person, the one wielding the gun did."

How can we get Advanced reviewers to be more responsible? I have not voted in a long time actually, because most people who get put up are voted in anyway. I vote rarely now, if a person actually catches my eye.
07/20/2010
Miss B Haven Miss B Haven
I think that if you take away points and incentive for upgrade votes it will probably go back to the way it was and people will only vote for those who deserve it.
07/20/2010
ToyTimeTim ToyTimeTim
(Eden DIY)
Quote:
Originally posted by Carrie Ann
It can take a LOT of reviews for someone to hit that minimum rank sometimes.

Lauren, I know you're trying to be helpful but the fact is, voting is fair. No one gets to just "up and join".

It is the already advanced reviewers who are ... More
I agree, a while ago after reading a review I was thinking no way they will make it to advanced. Next day they were upgraded. That means that five advanced reviewers voted them in. It may have been for just for points or someone they got to join. I don't know, but I was really shocked.

Like you say advanced reviewers need to be more responsible.

I also think that the new point system will see more changes as we go that will address some of these problems.
07/20/2010
Blinker Blinker
Quote:
Originally posted by bzzingbee
I had missed this in the other post also. I'm glad it is being considered to change that becuase I saw the same thing. I couldn't believe some of these reviews were getting votes. Some of them realllly need some work. I did vote for two people, I ... More
Yesss that's how it was with me. I was upgraded and then found out about the mentoring and was immediately interested. But I agree; it all ended up working out
07/20/2010
Tori Rebel Tori Rebel
I completely agree that voting on upgrades should not be point-worthy. As much as most here are honest and fair, there will always be people willing to take advantage of any system for personal gain and this is a very easy way to do so. I really hope they modify this, since they have considered it.
07/20/2010
buzzvibe buzzvibe
Ah, perhaps that's why I haven't seen any pending upgrades? For the past couple of days I've noticed that all the contributors on the community page are listed as recently promoted.
07/20/2010
Red Vinyl Kitty Red Vinyl Kitty
I do agree with removing the points for voting for a contributor upgrade. I think the eden points system is fine otherwise, but I've also noticed that there is not usually anyone listed on the voting page anymore. "Odd" how people are getting voted in so quickly.
07/20/2010
fatesrelease fatesrelease
I agree. Especially because people who are not ready to move on yet and need some help first are being pushed through. That isn't fair to people who had to work for it, or for the people being pushed through.
07/20/2010
SexyySarah SexyySarah
I agree, and I am guilty of voting a few in because of it, but one was on accident, I didn't mean to vote for a person but I guess I clicked it while brushing through.
07/20/2010
Gunsmoke Gunsmoke
Maybe it's just me. I really appreciate how hard the EF team works to keep the forum alive and relevant. The program is part of a business - it's not unethical. You may like to see it tweaked - but let's not get too demanding.

Thanks to the EF team for all they do!
07/20/2010
Envy Envy
What i noticed, and it's rather annoying, is the 'necroing' of all the really old threads....
07/20/2010
Red Vinyl Kitty Red Vinyl Kitty
Quote:
Originally posted by Envy
What i noticed, and it's rather annoying, is the 'necroing' of all the really old threads....
That doesn't bother me so much. I would rather have people bring back really old threads than posting three new threads on a topic which has already been discussed.
07/20/2010
PassionQT PassionQT
Quote:
Originally posted by Carrie Ann
It can take a LOT of reviews for someone to hit that minimum rank sometimes.

Lauren, I know you're trying to be helpful but the fact is, voting is fair. No one gets to just "up and join".

It is the already advanced reviewers who are ... More
"Advanced reviewers being more responsible about voting is."

I agree with the above statement. It's not like we can't see who is voting for the new reviewers anyhow. Gotta love the public voting!

We "should" vote responsibly because someone deserves it, they show potential, etc.,

At the same time, some new reviewers who want to be part of the community have never done this type of review before, so there is a learning curve. I had never seen such lengthy and detailed sex toy reviews before coming here, but I understand why we do it now. And it's fun to challenge myself and learn how to be a better writer at the same time!

So, perhaps some think that voting them "in" can give them a little boost of confidence, but it's really what they do after they are "in" that will matter the most. If they don't improve their reviews because they don't want to find ways to do so, their ranking will reflect that in the long run.
07/20/2010
KristiS77 KristiS77
I agree that it's the personal responsibility of an advanced reviewer to carefully choose who to vote in.

I don't feel like it's a slap in the face. I'm confident in the reviews I write and I enjoy helping others who are new to reviewing. I think we should spend our time more concerned with our own reviews and helping others instead of creating hoops for them to jump through.
07/20/2010
Victoria Victoria
(Doc Johnson)
Quote:
Originally posted by Gunsmoke
Maybe it's just me. I really appreciate how hard the EF team works to keep the forum alive and relevant. The program is part of a business - it's not unethical. You may like to see it tweaked - but let's not get too demanding.

Thanks to the EF ... More
Thank you! I totally agree!
07/20/2010
~LaUr3n~ ~LaUr3n~
Quote:
Originally posted by Carrie Ann
It can take a LOT of reviews for someone to hit that minimum rank sometimes.

Lauren, I know you're trying to be helpful but the fact is, voting is fair. No one gets to just "up and join".

It is the already advanced reviewers who are ... More
A lot of my recent ideas...actually most of them have been used on the site. I'd like to think this one has some weight as well.

That was only a suggestion for if the points for voting stayed. Maybe I didn't explain that well enough.

And I totally agree it is advanced reviewer's faults, but I don't see why that matters. They are no better that non-advanced in any other way than their review quality or newness (or at least that is how I thought it was supposed to be).

The points is the reason...which I think we all agreed on. So that is the issue, like I said in the beginning. The other stuff was just rambling, and as you say" there is nothing wrong with a little bit of rambling" right?

Just ideas spewing all at once. That's all.
07/20/2010
~LaUr3n~ ~LaUr3n~
Quote:
Originally posted by Envy
What i noticed, and it's rather annoying, is the 'necroing' of all the really old threads....
Are you saying you think this is because of points also?
07/20/2010
Carrie Ann Carrie Ann
(EdenFantasys)
Quote:
Originally posted by ~LaUr3n~
A lot of my recent ideas...actually most of them have been used on the site. I'd like to think this one has some weight as well.

That was only a suggestion for if the points for voting stayed. Maybe I didn't explain that well enough. ... More
Sorry. You pointedly asked me to respond to your other suggestions, so I did.

We actually talked about a lot of these issues before implementing points and when we implemented voting so, I guess, to the employees, it seems like rehashing of already covered material.
07/20/2010
~LaUr3n~ ~LaUr3n~
OK TO BE CLEAR:

The main issue... points are causing voting to be unfair because of the incentive of money and hence more awesome toys from EF.

That is all that needs to be discussed. Yes or no-does this need to change?

If no...THEN what can be done to make it more fair to ensure that even if people vote for points, it is not "irresponsible" as Carrie Ann stated. I totally agree with that. It's only one point isn't it? Apparently that one point is still too much.
07/20/2010
~LaUr3n~ ~LaUr3n~
Quote:
Originally posted by Carrie Ann
Sorry. You pointedly asked me to respond to your other suggestions, so I did.

We actually talked about a lot of these issues before implementing points and when we implemented voting so, I guess, to the employees, it seems like rehashing of ... More
Yes, because I couldn't tell from your response if you read the whole thing or jumped the gun and responded prematurely ( I do this on occasion-can't help it lol).

We are not employees of course, but are the community giving feedback on your ideas. We don't expect you guys to be perfect!
07/20/2010
Total posts: 91
Unique posters: 55