Spermicide and Numbing Agents

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Spermicide and Numbing Agents

Britni TheVadgeWig Britni TheVadgeWig
I wanted to bring up the topic of selling "unsafe" products on the site. EF is a sex positive community, and touts itself as a site you can trust. However, there are spermicidally lubricated condoms for sale on the site, as well as numbing agents. Many people don't know about the dangers of these products, and may buy them without knowing any better. I wonder about EF's decision to carry these items at all, and if it is something that is to remain for sale on the site, maybe some kind of a disclaimer, or educational piece about the potential dangers of these products? When I managed an adult toy store, I petitioned the owner to stop carrying these unsafe products and was so glad he listened. Because customers' health is the most important thing.

Spermicide (nonoxynol-9) is something they're trying to take off the market completely. It's no more effective than using a condom correctly, and over 50% of the population is allergic to it. Many people think they have a latex allergy, but it's actually the spermicide that they're reacting to. Not only that, it breaks down cell walls, making it more difficult to get pregnant when you actually want to, and opens small tears in the vaginal lining, making it easier to contract STDs. It can actually HELP to transmit the AIDS virus! Hence the reason many companies are going to stop producing it completely.

Numbing agents, usually used to numb the rectum to make anal play less painful, is also really dangerous. Besides the fact that I can't see what the fun or pleasure in being unable to feel what's happening to you, pain is our body's signal to us that something is wrong. If we can't feel pain, we don't know if there's a problem. Something could be ripping or tearing, and we would have no idea. Pain is our signal to slow down. If you do it correctly, it shouldn't hurt, anyway. Lube, warm up, and going slowly all can prevent pain associated with anal play. These numbing agents are just unsafe.

How do you guys feel? Do you think sites like EF, that promote safe sex and healthy, body-safe products should carry products like these? Should there be a warning or disclaimer on these products? EF, if you know that a product is potentially unsafe for your consumers, what would be your rationale behind continuing to carry it?
02/01/2010
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Miss Cinnamon Miss Cinnamon
Quote:
Originally posted by Britni TheVadgeWig
I wanted to bring up the topic of selling "unsafe" products on the site. EF is a sex positive community, and touts itself as a site you can trust. However, there are spermicidally lubricated condoms for sale on the site, as well as numbing ...
EF stopped carrying anal numbing products about a year ago. Contributors are still able to review these products, but they are no longer available for purchase.

As for the spermicidal condoms, I agree that they need to go.
02/01/2010
Luscious Lily Luscious Lily
Quote:
Originally posted by Miss Cinnamon
EF stopped carrying anal numbing products about a year ago. Contributors are still able to review these products, but they are no longer available for purchase.

As for the spermicidal condoms, I agree that they need to go.
I think there are one or two products that may have slipped through the cracks. I noticed numbing wipes two or three months back, which shocked me. I think I'll go find them again and bring it to the attention of the EF team so they can be pulled.
02/01/2010
Liz2 Liz2
Quote:
Originally posted by Miss Cinnamon
EF stopped carrying anal numbing products about a year ago. Contributors are still able to review these products, but they are no longer available for purchase.

As for the spermicidal condoms, I agree that they need to go.
I thought they were all discontinued by EF. My mother even told me that Consumers Report has been warning about spermicidal condoms for a few years. And besides the spermicide on a condom is just about useless for birth control anyway.
02/01/2010
Saraid Saraid
I totally agree. Also, the IO relaxing sprays should go as well. I don't care if they don't numb - your body should tell you when you are ready for penetration, not some creepy muscle relaxer.
02/01/2010
Carrie Ann Carrie Ann
Quote:
Originally posted by Saraid
I totally agree. Also, the IO relaxing sprays should go as well. I don't care if they don't numb - your body should tell you when you are ready for penetration, not some creepy muscle relaxer.
Wow. I totally disagree on this. There's nothing in those but clove, sunflower seed and lemon balm in some silicone.

It's not like it's spray on valium or pumpable roofies.
02/01/2010
LicentiouslyYours LicentiouslyYours
Quote:
Originally posted by Luscious Lily
I think there are one or two products that may have slipped through the cracks. I noticed numbing wipes two or three months back, which shocked me. I think I'll go find them again and bring it to the attention of the EF team so they can be pulled.
I think maybe the wipes that are still up for sale are there because they are marketed as a post-anal sex product, for use on sore or chaffed skin.

Certainly, you could still use them as a numbing agent before anal-sex, but you could use any lidocaine product on the market in the same way.
02/01/2010
Luscious Lily Luscious Lily
Quote:
Originally posted by LicentiouslyYours
I think maybe the wipes that are still up for sale are there because they are marketed as a post-anal sex product, for use on sore or chaffed skin.

Certainly, you could still use them as a numbing agent before anal-sex, but you could use any ...
Ok, that's understandable. From the description, I wasn't sure - I assumed from the description that it was used before, but that was my mistake. Either way, it makes me a little uneasy, but that's the EF teams call. ^__^
02/01/2010
Saraid Saraid
Quote:
Originally posted by Carrie Ann
Wow. I totally disagree on this. There's nothing in those but clove, sunflower seed and lemon balm in some silicone.

It's not like it's spray on valium or pumpable roofies.
So I take back my non-numbing statement. I remembered that clove is a natural numbing agent that's been used for centuries. I don't care if they say it's organic, it shouldn't be going on anyone's ass for anal play.
02/01/2010
Victoria Victoria
I pointed our Product Management team to this thread this morning.

In the interim, I can say we have made efforts to remove any potentially harmful lubes, sprays, creams etc – long before many of our competitors followed suit. We don’t just tout ourselves as sex-positive; I believe we do the work that earns that credibility.

I clicked over and read the Advocate’s article on Nonoxynol-9 Spermicide – I think this information will be taken into consideration. This is a tough call for many retailers (not just Eden), when there is conflicting information from the health organizations vs the FDA vs the manufacturer – and where do you legally draw the line with disclaimers? While it is not illegal to stop carrying a product altogether, it is walking a fine line of legality to draft disclaimers and such about a manufacturer’s products.

This industry is especially challenged when trying to identify material and chemical safety issues. For this reason, a few years ago, we created and started using the Material Safety index graphics for every product (see the example on this page), as well as publishing our guides and A – Z materials index. I believe Rufina spoke on the forums before about how this information is determined on our end – using the manufacturer’s information as well as independent research. These ratings are determined in-house, not just because a company told us it was completely safe.

We appreciate the information. Bear in mind, direct emails to the Eden staff who actually chose our product assortment would be much more effective.

Please do not ever hesitate to let us know about any news/ studies / recalls / findings related to products – even if we don’t currently carry the products. The more we know, the better! Thanks
02/01/2010
Fred Petrenko Fred Petrenko
Thank you for pointing out. I have been under impression that all spermicide contained products had gone. It is indeed the understanding and the policy at Eden. Time to clean up the house. We'll review all condom selection and will discontinue the spermicide-contained ones asap.

All chemical numbing agents have been discontinued. The one containing herbal oils will go to the deeper investigation. We'll be posting the result for you shortly.

@BritniTheVadgeWig – thank you for the reminder and informative post. This is the perfect example of community proactive guidance and advice.
02/01/2010
Carrie Ann Carrie Ann
Quote:
Originally posted by Saraid
So I take back my non-numbing statement. I remembered that clove is a natural numbing agent that's been used for centuries. I don't care if they say it's organic, it shouldn't be going on anyone's ass for anal play.
Hmmm. I didn't think small amounts of clove were numbing. Like in chai tea, etc....?
02/01/2010
Miss Cinnamon Miss Cinnamon
Quote:
Originally posted by Carrie Ann
Hmmm. I didn't think small amounts of clove were numbing. Like in chai tea, etc....?
A brief glance around the internet later, I only know that it's the eugenol in clove oil that causes numbing. Eugenol is used in medicine as a local anesthetic (among other things). Cloves have been used to treat toothaches, sore throats, and so on and so forth. It looks like you don't need a whole lot for it to work, either.

I guess I'll wait patiently for the experts to figure this one out! Whatever the verdict, it's a comfort to know that EF is 100% for the safety and pleasure of its customers and community!
02/01/2010
Sir Sir
Edenfantasys is a big site, so it isn't really such an extreme thing that some may have, like Luscious Lily said, "slipped through the cracks." They do great here to make everything as safe as possible for the consumer, and give a ton of helpful information, like uses, safety, etc. I think that Edenfantasys does a great job in every department of the sex toy selling industry that they can, and if they missed some, then I am sure that they will take care of it as soon as possible to keep their customers safe.

I do not know, but muscle relaxers sound nice for massages. Maybe that's just me...HAHA!!! And chai tea is absolutely delicious, mm. Chai tea lattes are even better.
02/01/2010
Britni TheVadgeWig Britni TheVadgeWig
Thank you guys for replying so quickly, and considering my post. Victoria, in the future, I'll definitely email the staff directly.

If the numbing agents are no longer sold, I may have seen a review, and that was my misunderstanding. If a product or two slipped through the cracks, and that's what I saw, I'll be sure to let you guys know.

As for the spermicide, it's pretty much accepted that it facilitates the spread of HIV, and most STDs, and is being discontinued slowly. However, I understand why you would wait to be totally sure about it. Either way, thanks for replying and looking out for the people you cater to.
02/02/2010
Victoria Victoria
Quote:
Originally posted by Britni TheVadgeWig
Thank you guys for replying so quickly, and considering my post. Victoria, in the future, I'll definitely email the staff directly.

If the numbing agents are no longer sold, I may have seen a review, and that was my misunderstanding. If a ...
Thanks so much, Britni! We do really appreciate the feedback and any news.

Fred confirmed with me today that we will be discontinuing the sale of any product containing Nonoxynol-9 Spermicide.

This is not only the spirit of our community, but a major factor in why we wanted to create Eden Link - so that questions like these can go directly to manufacturers as well.

We are looking into organic ingredients and have already asked for feedback earlier today from one of our contacts.

Thanks again!
02/02/2010
Luscious Lily Luscious Lily
Quote:
Originally posted by Victoria
Thanks so much, Britni! We do really appreciate the feedback and any news.

Fred confirmed with me today that we will be discontinuing the sale of any product containing Nonoxynol-9 Spermicide.

This is not only the spirit of our ...
Have we told you lately how awesome you are?
02/02/2010
Rebecca Rebecca
Hello Everyone,

This is certainly an interesting and important discussion.

Clove oil does cause a slight desenitsation but not enough that someone would not feel pain (which is important to avoid injury). Chemical products such as LIDOCAINE or BENZOCAINE actually deaden the nerves in the skin so there is complete numbness. It is also known to be toxic if used for long periods of time.

Using clove oil to relax the anus is a much safer choice than either a numbing agent that allows the person to feel nothing (so what's the point right????) or to have the person all tight with angst (literally), especially if they are a newbie and in that case there might be tearing etc.

Thanks very much for everyone's interest and support!!!

Cheers

Rebecca
02/04/2010
Total posts: 18
Unique posters: 11