Bullying Because They're Different?

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Bullying Because They're Different?

M. Roth M. Roth
I'm sure that this has been touched on. And if not, I feel like it's something that needed to be talked about. I read it in the paper, watched the news, and everything about a week ago.

A poor kid named Jamey Rodemeyer from Buffalo, New York killed himself about a week ago from being bullied about being gay. His sister went to homecoming, and they teased HER about what happened to him.

Again, I'm not sure how many people are comfortable talking about this, but I feel like I really need to vent, and EF is a community that would understand, and share my disgust at what happened to this poor child.

I don't understand why people think it's okay to bully someone for being different from them. Whether or not they're gay, disabled, of a different religion, or simply because they come from a family that makes less/more than yours does. It just really upsets me, since I was teased all throughout high school for being a big girl, and for dressing in gothic clothing.

Does anyone have any experiences they're willing to share, or thoughts about this? I mean, I can't even explain the rage and disgust this ignites in me at what these children, and their family, have had to face.

I'm not looking to start a fight, I simply want to see what others feel about the subject.
09/28/2011
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Peggi Peggi
It really sickens me to see people getting bullied. I was never bullied in school, but somehow managed to be that one magnet no matter where I moved or what school I went to, where all of the kids who were bullied sorta flocked to me, and I swear my parents and I will never understand how I got through school without a single expulsion for fighting. It got to the point where my High School counselor, Mr. Cole, had to actually see me every Friday, because of the constant fighting, and yet nothing was ever done to help my friends because "kids will be kids"! It hurt. A lot.

I had one friend in particular, she was actually bullied for the same reason you mentioned. She was constantly made fun of because she was heavy. She started hurting herself in the 10th grade because she was so depressed and I remember being really scared because at the time, I was her only friend, so I was the only one who knew and I promised not to tell anyone because that was the only reason she told me, but I was worried she would kill herself. So that was a really tough situation to be in! She and I are still friends til this day and we graduated over 5 years ago. But it was tough for her in high school and tough on me because I know what bullying did to her.

I had another friend I've known since 2nd grade and he dropped out of school because he would literally get sick every day at the thought of having to go to school and he was that "fag" that everyone liked to beat up after school. I think he could've done a lot more with his life if he hadn't been bullied as much as he was. He did get his GED finally but he is so smart and could've gotten college degrees and had a better job (he thinks so too) if he hadn't had to drop out.

I think that bullies need to be locked up. If they're too young to put in jail, put them in juvi! It should be considered a crime!
09/28/2011
Alan & Michele Alan & Michele
Bullies make me furious, their parents even more so, and it really pisses me off that the authorities never seem to want to do anything about either of them. I've never understood the excuse of "It's just kids being kids" either. That's like saying it's acceptable for them to hurt each other, so don't even bother to try to teach them that it's wrong. Just when *do* these people think it's appropriate for that lesson to be learned? And then they wonder why our society is so full of criminals these days.
09/28/2011
ss143 ss143
I have no tolerance for bullies. I was teased and bullied most of the time I was in school horribly by kids and was even singled out by teachers. I was bullied because I was heavy because I didn't do what other kid did I came from a family that didn't have money etc any and every reason. It made me hate school and I dreaded going everyday. I loved to learn but I hated the environment. It wasn't until I socked a kid in school for trying to set me on fire that people left me alone.

Bullies and those around who allow/do nothing to stop it upset me to the point that I don't have words for it. I only wish that those who are getting bullied of course didn't have to but would be able to depend on someone to help them stop it before it gets to the point of death or permanent scaring. I know for me even after all these years I still harbor mental scars and troubled emotions about my self worth and value because of it and it's one of the reasons I have severe trust issues.
09/28/2011
M. Roth M. Roth
I'm so thankful I didn't start a fight, you have no idea..

But Peggi, I missed most of my Freshman year for this reason. Sadly, I also resorted to hurting myself, then to substance abuse.. I had issues all the way up through my Junior year, when my life suddenly changed for no apparent reason at all. It was really awful.

Today, I look back at all the kids who bullied me, and they've gotten nowhere in life. While I may not be able to get into/afford college because of my grades, my personality has taken my far. I'm six months into my new job and I have an assistant manager promotion lined up for me in December. I can't say that they're doing so well at all.

But I can't look back at in and laugh. It still hurts too much. They say you'll move on and get over it, but I don't think you ever do. It haunts you for the rest of your life.

It really is criminal, and I don't understand why it isn't seen that way. It doesn't matter if they're an adolescent. They know right from wrong at that point, and it makes me sick to my stomach that their parents will either condone what their child is doing, or turn a blind eye! While you can't control your children, you can teach them proper behavior.. And letting them bully another child certainly isn't appropriate behavior.

But it's really good that he got his GED! I feel like it still shows that he has the initiative to go somewhere in life. It's just so shameful that he had to go through that, there's no rhyme or reason for why it happens.

I was friends with this girl since my Freshman year. She got pregnant at 17, and was teased so mercilessly that she got expelled for fighting. She's since then struggling to raise her child, and get her GED. People just don't realize the damage that they cause..

Alan & Michele, I'm on the same wavelength. They wonder why there are some people who snap and go on killing sprees, and all of that nature.. But they never look into their past, they simply say that they were "severely disturbed."

I realize I seem to have quite a bit to say, but again, I just can't even fathom this.. And I can't express the rage and disgust properly. It makes my stomach churn, and brings tears to my eyes.
09/28/2011
M. Roth M. Roth
Quote:
Originally posted by ss143
I have no tolerance for bullies. I was teased and bullied most of the time I was in school horribly by kids and was even singled out by teachers. I was bullied because I was heavy because I didn't do what other kid did I came from a family that ...
I really went through the exact same thing.. Although nobody went so far as to set me on fire, it was completely and utterly awful. I had a complete rage burst and really hurt somebody, and that's when the school finally did something about it. Sadly, it didn't stop until my Junior year. =/

I know what you mean about the scaring, though. I still have nightmares about everything I was forced to go through, and every time I see a child being bullied, I have a bubbling up of emotions from having to relive the same thing. I trust nobody, and I have some real relationship problems.

I know people say that therapy helps, but I honestly think that unless they've gone through it, it isn't something they can understand and help you with. It's so different for each person, that it's so hard to help them cope.
09/28/2011
Kkay Kkay
Bullying is being trapped without an out. It's torture, plain and simple. That so little is done about it... think about what the reaction would be if someone showed even a fragment of the bullying behavior that children regularly experience as an adult.

It's a difficult topic for me to talk about. I was heavily abused as a child, and my experiences in school showed me that far from having a safe haven, I instead had one more place in which people could submit me to endless pain. More than once bullying made me attempt suicide, and thinking about this right now is putting me in a very not-good state mentally, so I'm just going to hit post and go do something else.
09/28/2011
ss143 ss143
Quote:
Originally posted by M. Roth
I really went through the exact same thing.. Although nobody went so far as to set me on fire, it was completely and utterly awful. I had a complete rage burst and really hurt somebody, and that's when the school finally did something about it. ...
I agree about the therapy thing I have tried it in the past and some would say talking about your problems/past and such help but I found none of them could understand and for me thinking about those things and other stuff just gets me in a bad mental place that I try very very hard not to go to specially now that I have my boys gets kinda hard to explain to my 7 year old why mom is all cut up..... again.

Just wish people and especially kids didn't have to go through being bullied, abused or made to feel less because they are different, for who they are or for any reason at that.
09/28/2011
M. Roth M. Roth
I certainly agree. Nobody should be made to suffer for who they are. It's been a rough journey, and I still feel like people see me as a fat cow, branded as a slut..

I don't have children, so I can't relate. But I do have a younger sister who looks up to me, and it's been a struggle to be strong for her, since she has to suffer for things that are so infantile in nature. It just doesn't make sense.

Kkay, I'm sorry to have brought up painful memories for you. It wasn't my intention to do so.
09/28/2011
Wildchild Wildchild
Quote:
Originally posted by M. Roth
I'm sure that this has been touched on. And if not, I feel like it's something that needed to be talked about. I read it in the paper, watched the news, and everything about a week ago.

A poor kid named Jamey Rodemeyer from Buffalo, ...
I don't know what the answer to this on going snow balling issue is.

I remember being picked on for so many things: wearing glasses, the clothes I wore, my Granma walking me to school, not buying lunch, bringing a bagged lunch. It didn't matter waht I did, I was picked on.

I was told time and time again, "turn the other cheak", "walk away", "Don't add fuel to the fire" and so many other things. I did what I was told and asked and then one day I SNAPPED! I beat the piss out of the bully. I'm not saying I was right, however that person never fucked with me again. The other kids had more respect for me (or were scared of me) either way they left me alone. This went on in elemetry, middle and high school.

In no way should anyone intenionally harm anyone. I feel hatred in heart for the people that go in and shoot up schools and say "I did it because they picked on me". That solves no problems, it causes more problems and truly is a tragedy.

It's not just kids that bully kids, there are teachers out there that do the same. I really think when a teacher belittles a student infront of everyone it teaches other kids that it's ok. IT"S NOT! I had a 9th grade Science Teacher that did this to students, including me. He used to verbally abuse students that were slow, retarded or did not give the correct answer. He would squirt them in the face with a sqitzer bottle and throw objects at these students.

A few years after I graduated, This Teacher who taught in Northeast PA was busted for this. My understanding of what happened is: He fucked with the wrong kid who in turned knocked him on his ass. The State Police were called and they started the investigation, other kids stepped up and told there stories of the horror form this teacher.

Like I said I don't know what the correct answer is, the way society continues to spiral out of control I fear this will esculate before it gets better. I do know that society was a lot friendlier and safer when I was little, and safer back when my grandparents were kids. The answer may lie in the past.
09/28/2011
Shellz31 Shellz31
The bully side of it angers me cause my brother was a victim of it. I was also bullied in my early years of primary school.
I won't comment on the rest of the subject cause for sure people will get uppitty about it.

But the main point - bullies suck and teachers should be doing more to protect victims!
09/28/2011
P'Gell P'Gell
I was a weird kid, smart, opinionated. We didn't have a lot of money as my dad was still in Grad School, so my clothes were cheap and crappy. I was teased a lot, bullied, in 6th and 7th grade so badly I was close to suicide. When we moved at the beginning of 8th grade I had the ability to stay at my old school or go to a new one. I chose, at the start of 8th grade to start over at a new school.

As the schools were close, some of the "mean girls" knew the a mean girls at my new school. One day the mean girl at my new school came up to me and said that people at my old school were saying that I said I was more "popular" than she was. WTF? That wasn't the kind of thing I even thought of. This little bitch tried to perpetuate what I was trying to get away from. BUT, my new friends all stood around me, and told the mean girl to piss off. She was so mean and exclusive that by the middle of 8th grade she had alienated everyone in our small school. She ended up going to a Catholic High School as her rep was ruined and despite the fact that she was a "mean girl" she was only "popular" in her own mind. Really, why do people act like her? The other kids refused to go along with her self appointed royalty. (They had in 6th and7th grade, but something happened and people decided not to listen to her mean ways anymore.) She left in disgrace, due to her own actions of trying to break peoples' friendships apart.

I've never before or since see a mean girl get what she deserved. I would like to see this happen more often.

My solution is to isolate the mean girls, put them into a "special class" maybe a special ed class where they will be the different ones. Or in a completely different school, where they have NO contact with their lieutenants etc, and have no opportunities to bring any other girls into their evil ways of thinking. Keep them there until High School is over. Do not allow them to try out for Cheer leading (fuck, ELIMINATE Cheer Leading, it will make the Mean Girl less common at the start!) or other activities, (they can joining Chess Club or Video Gaming Club if they want, see how they do there) and basically force them to feel what the trodden upon girls feel every fucking day. If these girls even have feelings...

I went through it and I saw my older two girls go through it and I am TERRIFIED for my nearly 12 year old daughter with Aspergers and Tourettes. I swear I will take matters into my own hands if she gets bullied if the schools do nothing, as the teachers often "see nothing" and often try to make friends with the "popular girls" to either relive their own childhoods as mean girls or make up for their own bullied lives as young girls who were left out.

Many Queen Bee mean girls have personality disorders (look at their behavior; manipulative, mean, non-empathetic, cruel, disruptive to others' friendships) it's been proven that most either cannot relate to or refuse to learn to relate to people different than they are) and those kinds of disorders don't respond to therapy.

Hell, Throw them a bone, let them try, but I don't see them changing. They are the same in their 30s and 40s as they were when they were 12. I think most of them are incapable of Internal Growth and self introspection and any ability to see themselves or have empathy for others. Again, these are Personality Disorder traits.

The Mean Girls need to be identified, labeled and dealt with as fully and publicly as possible.

I didn't see the boys as bad as the girls, it happened, but it was different. Not being a boy, I can't relate to it, but I'm willing to bet some guys here have some ideas on how to deal with Bully Boys. Maybe disallow them from participating in any sports and take them out of PE class; that is where a LOT of bullying happens, because so many PE teachers seem to relate to the Bully Boys and the Mean Girls.
09/28/2011
Peggi Peggi
Quote:
Originally posted by M. Roth
I'm so thankful I didn't start a fight, you have no idea..

But Peggi, I missed most of my Freshman year for this reason. Sadly, I also resorted to hurting myself, then to substance abuse.. I had issues all the way up through my Junior ...
I am so sorry to hear what you went through!!!

I'm glad you made it, though. It is too sad to see the reports of those who couldn't.
09/28/2011
P'Gell P'Gell
Quote:
Originally posted by Wildchild
I don't know what the answer to this on going snow balling issue is.

I remember being picked on for so many things: wearing glasses, the clothes I wore, my Granma walking me to school, not buying lunch, bringing a bagged lunch. It ...
I'm sorry you were hurt so badly. I agree that this kind of bullying even in grade school IS a crime, and it should be treated as one. Let the Mean Girls spend some times in Juvie Hall and see how that works for them. Make bullying a Hate Crime. I don't know if there is anything that can be done to "fix" the bullies and the mean girls. I really don't.

I saw mean girls from my High School still acting the same way at our 10th and 15th reunion. I saw one of the girls (by high school, I was actually doing OK with the kids I hung with, and our HS was so large that the mean girls had little influence on most of us) I saw one girl in the bathroom, 28 years old, and I simply said, "Hi, Sherri." She literally turned her nose up, went, " Tsk, Uch." and walked away! This is a mother, a wife and a grown woman? Still acting like a 12 year old girl. And, I do need to say, I looked freaking HOT at my reunions and she had let herself go. I guess all those memories of what a beautiful cheerleader she was in 7th and 8th grade through Senior year was the pinnacle of her life. That's pathetic.

I do disagree, though that things were nicer, friendlier and safer long ago. I grew up in a rough neighborhood in Chicago. I know I was bullied and I'm older than you were, I know women my mother's age who were not only bullied but sexually abused by relatives, I think we may look at the past and see only the good. But, Mean Girls were always with us. The reason they still are? The refusal to identify them and deal with them.

I hope your wounds heal. I always think mine have, and then a discussion like this sets it off again. I've forgiven and healed from sexual abuse when I was young, but the bullying still stays with me. I honestly think the bullying was worse than the abuse. I mean that sincerely. A child should be able to trust her peers. When she can't, she feels she has nothing.
09/28/2011
Illusional Illusional
I get bullied a lot.
My mother raised me to speak very good English and let me watch X-files and operas and such. Also, cause I had a Japanese first name I really wanted to get into the culture.
I've always been the laughing stock of my family, then in schools.
Inner city schools, where I was supposed to mingle and grow with my people?
I spent four months in middle school hiding in the bathrooms, with my grades slipping. My mom would scream at me every night and accuse me of doing drugs and I was grounded and everything. I just couldn't admit to her that I was having issues. Finally, when one girl blacked my eye I had to fess up, and she instantly switched me out of schools, after pressing charges.


She sent me to a much better middle school and HS, and while there was some teasing, I roamed the halls freely.

Now, as an adult.. I'm in Maryland, which can be ghetto and I get made fun of a lot. By co-workers and everything, it still hurts my feelings but.. whatever.
I like what I like. So what if I'm literate? I do not tolerate bullying.
My nephew is homeschooled and tries to play with the boys in his neighborhood, he's simply too naive to understand they are bullying him until he's facedown in the dirt. The urge to kick those boys in their faces, is overwhelming.
09/28/2011
P'Gell P'Gell
Quote:
Originally posted by ss143
I agree about the therapy thing I have tried it in the past and some would say talking about your problems/past and such help but I found none of them could understand and for me thinking about those things and other stuff just gets me in a bad ...
Hugs to you, ss. I'm sorry you suffered so much, too. Some therapists can't relate to why some of us still feel the pain from bullying. I don't know if they were bullies themselves (many come from rich families, who could afford Grad School through the PhD level, so it's possible) BUT, there are good therapists out there who can help with PTSD. Don't give up trying to find someone who will help you.

Hugs and Love.
09/28/2011
P'Gell P'Gell
Quote:
Originally posted by Illusional
I get bullied a lot.
My mother raised me to speak very good English and let me watch X-files and operas and such. Also, cause I had a Japanese first name I really wanted to get into the culture.
I've always been the laughing stock of my ...
I'm sorry this happened to you. I grew up in a rough neighborhood and part of my bullying was because I came from educated parents and was taught to not only speak standard English (instead of Chicago-ease) but, I was raised not to be racist and not to use racist words. The neighborhood I grew up in was very racist and everyone, even the kids used words for African American people, Latino people, Asian people ect that I refuse to use even to this day. I was the ONLY child in my 2nd grade classroom who thought it was terrible that our teacher used the N word. She used the N word IN the classroom and nobody thought anything of it. Everyone was so used to it being "normal" speech. Sickening, even to this day.

Why my parents didn't get us the hell out of there is a mystery. But, neither of them ever wanted to spend a dime on anything, and I think living among racist animals, despite my parents dislike of them was preferable to them than to moving to a nicer neighborhood where money would have to be spent.

I can feel similarly to what you went through. Not exactly, but a similar thing.

Hugs again.
09/28/2011
Illusional Illusional
Quote:
Originally posted by P'Gell
I'm sorry this happened to you. I grew up in a rough neighborhood and part of my bullying was because I came from educated parents and was taught to not only speak standard English (instead of Chicago-ease) but, I was raised not to be racist and ...
09/28/2011
ss143 ss143
Quote:
Originally posted by P'Gell
Hugs to you, ss. I'm sorry you suffered so much, too. Some therapists can't relate to why some of us still feel the pain from bullying. I don't know if they were bullies themselves (many come from rich families, who could afford Grad ...
Thanks P'Gell your a kind person

I have been through so many therapist for my depression anxiety panic and just trying to cope with my past and my issues its hard to think or believe I could find someone who could help. It just makes it worse because they cant relate and hell I have had therapist dump me I didn't think that was possible but literally went to call for the next appointment and they never get back to me. What a mind mess up that was to get through twice. How could someone who is getting paid to listen and talk to you say nope not worth the money.....I am destined to do it how I always have and that's keep it in and not say a word lol
09/28/2011
Chilipepper Chilipepper
Relating what happened to me will only upset me (as I'm transitioning between anti-depressants right now and very vulnerable). However, I will say that I came away with a few things:

1. Children are barbaric savages and should be treated accordingly when they act that way.
2. One of the reasons I don't want children is so they won't be subjected to such hell.
3. If only the people who tell me to "Get over it, it's been 15 years!" knew how much I wanted to use a baseball bat on them.
4. The public school system is the best way to kill the soul of a sensitive child.
5. Death is too kind and brief - I hope my tormenters have the most horrific lives possible because of what they did.

Bitter? Damn right I am.
09/28/2011
P'Gell P'Gell
I want to everybody on this thread.

ss NO doctor should ignore a patient.

Hugs and love to all of you. To a future of unique happiness.
09/28/2011
Starkiller87 Starkiller87
Bullying makes me sick. I was terribly bullied as a kid. They used to throw food in my hair, and call my house all the time making fun of me. They used to call me howard stern because I had really thick hair. In group projects no one would let me help and they would act like I had the plague and I couldnt even touch the papers or anything. They always set up things to humiliate me infront of the whole school during lunch periods or breakfast. It was like a movie, where Id be the one kid standing there crying while a few hundred kids pointed a laughed. The teacher would notice and constantly yell at them, and she was always on the phone with my mother about it. I cried almost every single day coming home, and than tried to kill myself. It was just about that bad. I had to go to a lot of therapy.

Now all of them have had kids before high school, and none of them went to college. I live in LA and work on movies. So what doesn't kill you makes you stronger aye.

-p.s. p'gell I grew up in chicago. The rougher neighborhoods. I was the pale mexican kid who couldnt speak a lick of spanish. Which made all of the bully happen 10 fold cause I wasnt like the other kids.
09/28/2011
P'Gell P'Gell
Quote:
Originally posted by Starkiller87
Bullying makes me sick. I was terribly bullied as a kid. They used to throw food in my hair, and call my house all the time making fun of me. They used to call me howard stern because I had really thick hair. In group projects no one would let me ...
Oh, honey.

My best friend was also the "pale Mexican girl who couldn't speak Spanish." It was rough for her, then she moved to our neighborhood where some racist people didn't like Latino people, it was rough for her all over.

Things get better, though. I'm glad you made good use of your life.
09/28/2011
js250 js250
I was severely bullied in school. My family was poor, I wore donated clothes, had no electricity and was also very tiny. I grew up with a serious complex and also became suicidal as a teenager and young adult. Even now, there are times I revert to my old insecurities. I was also put in a special class for 'geeks', I have a very high IQ. The summer between my freshman and sophomore year, I developed D cups, had a 22" waist, etc. The first week of 10th grade, I seemed to be quite popular and naively welcomed it - until everyone claimed to have slept with me, etc. I was still a virgin, was absolutely crushed and quit school. Suicide attempt #1. I will shorten the story, we don't have years to read everything.

I started bartending, I was accepted by adults for who I was. My boss talked me into getting my GED. I passed first time I tested, with the highest score in essay, comprehension and science. I started talking to and helping people with their problems and made a difference in two peoples lives.I made some lifelong friends. I was still insecure and shy and falling apart. What saved me was getting pregnant with my child.

I realized that if I was going to be the mother that I wanted to be for my child, I had to find a way to cope and turn myself around. I used my past as a learning curve. What was the positive that grew out of the negativity I grew up with?

1. I am a sincerely caring person. 2. I empathize with people and their situations without judging them. 3. I am loyal and very giving to those who deserve it. 4. I do not give up...until there is no other option, (this can be a bad thing). 5. I appreciate the differences and choices other people make. 6. I am grateful for true friends, love, and have an innate desire for happiness. 7. I make myself happy, I do not depend on others for my happiness. 8. My child has grown into a person I am immensely proud of and am honored to know. 9. Life sucks, gets better and sucks again - but for every door that is closed one will open again.

Take your experiences and use them for good. It is the only way I can survive and be happy. I fail frequently and am depressed occasionally, but I am also at peace with the fact that what you go through makes you a better person if you use it for positive in the future.
09/28/2011
GravyCakes GravyCakes
i have heard a number of stories where something like this has happened, & it makes me physically sick sometimes. but the fact that people are teasing his sister about her brother's suicide, that really makes me sick. wtf is wrong w/ people? if someone dies, you don't tease their friends & family about it. what is our world coming to?
09/28/2011
Chilipepper Chilipepper
Quote:
Originally posted by GravyCakes
i have heard a number of stories where something like this has happened, & it makes me physically sick sometimes. but the fact that people are teasing his sister about her brother's suicide, that really makes me sick. wtf is wrong w/ ...
Something really disgusting is one young lady had committed suicide because of bullying, and the bullies came to the funeral to make fun of her corpse in front of her family.

I personally think rabid dogs should be shot ... they obviously have no souls.
09/28/2011
El-Jaro El-Jaro
Even though it might not be a popular opinion, I don't think the schools themselves have much power over bullies. Think about it, teachers can't really do much with disruptive students except send them to the principle's office.

I chalk most of the blame up to the parents of bullies. They're the ones who raised their kids to make fun of other kids through either encouragement or neglect. And these would probably be the same parents who throw fits in PTA meetings and threaten to sue school districts.

If you haven't researched it, the "It gets Better" movement is awesome!
09/28/2011
P'Gell P'Gell
JR, I kind of see where you are coming from, but the schools could do more. They mainly ignore it, and then claim they didn't know it was happening.

They make other forms of misbehavior very unacceptable, with severe punishments, up to and including expulsion and even calling the police. Many forms of bullying, if one adult did them to an other would be considered Assault and Battery. The schools should take bullying from kids as seriously as adults who beat people up and cause them emotional harm.

You're right about a lot of the parents. But a LOT of the parents of the bullies are the women ON the PTA! Yet one more reason the school ignores these kids' behavior.
09/28/2011
js250 js250
JR, that is a great movement!! P'Gell, I agree, the schools, parents and law enforcement need to get more involved. There needs to be a safe haven for kids being bullied.
09/28/2011
Total posts: 29
Unique posters: 14