Sorry but I need to get this off my chest.

Okay, now that I've responded to various posts in this thread, I'll respond to the main one lol..

Tim, I agree completely with you. I'll admit, sometimes I'll say "there are some reviews on the product which give great information on *such and such*". That's usually when I can't give my own opinion though because I don't own or have tried the product. I never reply with the intention to not be welcoming. I usually try and be super nice. I hope no one has ever taken my comments in a mean way.

If I think a post is point-farmy, then I usually just don't reply at all and skip it.

I don't want people to get upset by me saying this but I think that there are just as many complaint threads as there are "point-farmy" threads and like you said Tim, how do we even know they are trying to point-farm? Maybe they're just new and don't know there way around yet, etc. A lot of members are saying that they don't visit the forums as often anymore because of all the "spammy" threads or whatever. Honestly though, I've been coming here less (on the forums) because there seems like an over abundance of bitching, complaining, whining threads. That to me is unwelcoming and negative and it's annoying to see thread after thread being about how people don't like how people set lures, don't like how people say "thank you" on their reviews instead of long paragraphed comments, don't like pictures in reviews, blah blah blah.

I know I probably sound jerky, and I hope no one hates me now because of this but I'm sure there are a few others who feel the same. I can't be the only one! less

Exactly! There was one comment on one of my reviews that said, "yay" and that was it. I was like, "ummm... yay what?" If someone posts something that totally doesn't make any sense, then maybe a person could be like, "are they point farming?" but a "thank you"? That sort of makes sense to me. I dunno less

Exactly! There was one comment on one of my reviews that said, "yay" and that was it. I was like, "ummm... yay what?" If someone posts something that totally doesn't make any sense, then maybe a person could be like, "are they point farming?" but a "thank you"? That sort of makes sense to me. I dunno less

I think that some people might just put "" or simple comments like "yay" as a way of replying. I've spoken to people who have told me that they feel it's rude to read and not reply.

I think we just need to remember that not everyone is point farming. Sometimes the "" in the comments can be genuine from a newcomer that hasn't quite learned how things are meant to be done on this website. less

I first found EF back in 2010, I was looking for a P-spot toy and Eden was the first site that showed up when I did a Google search. Not only did I find an ass load of toys to choose from, I also found this wonderful forum. It was filled with welcoming contributors that are more than happy to help out and give advice. The whole atmosphere was welcoming and I was so happy to find a place where folks could ask anything they wanted and not be judged based on their orientation, background, color etc. etc.

All this and free toys too, hell ya! Never had I dreamed that a site like this existed or that I would find a site like this with people from all walks of life that made me comfortable talking about stuff that I could not talk to my friends or family about.

Fast forward two years, many changes and lots of new faces. We not only enjoy all of these wonderful activities and perks but Eden has been gracious enough to add points for doing these things. This was the icing on the cake for me and to this day I cannot believe that a company would be so giving to its customers. Where else I ask you, can you find all this in one place?

Now to the point of all this. Since the points were added there have been numerous post, threads, discussions and what not that seem like they are nothing more than point farming, that is folks just trying to rack up as many points as possible. I do agree that some of them are doing just that but I see so many that are justified questions. An example would be the “Do you like this” type thread. As most of you know, there is always a box on a product page that reads “Start a discussion”, when I first saw this I figured this was how I asked about a product on the forums. In fact I used this for just that many times. There are times when a product does not have reviews that tell me what I need to know.

Is that not what it is for?

Lately I have seen all too often that a contributor will automatically say “read the reviews”, is this a welcoming attitude? Is this what we want newcomers to see when they ask questions? Do you ever think, "Boy that sure was nice of so and so to say, I bet that person feels really good now." (sarcastically) Honestly, I probably would have left with my tail between my legs and never came back to the forums.

How many potentially great contributors have we lost from comments like this? Y’all do know that this is a company that is in business to make money, right? How many customers has EF lost due to our actions?

Do y’all think we as a community can be a bit harsh at times? I understand that most of these threads are indeed spam or point farming but how do we know for sure? Can we read the minds of folks over the internet, what about when the person really wanted to know?

Something else that gets me, does everyone think that EF can solve these problems over night? Things like this take time to fix, have some consideration for the powers that be. There are other issues that EF has to deal with too. I may say they are gods but I know that they can’t just snap their fingers to fix things, let’s get behind them and support the work they do.

Sorry for the rant but honestly, I am starting to feel that the welcoming community that I fell in love with two years ago is losing its appeal. I know that we only want the best for the community and yes, the point farming can be too much at times, but how is chasing folks off going to help the problem. Why not just ignore the threads and let them fall to the bottom of the list, remarking that they should “Read the reviews first” or “You should do a search first” only keeps the thread on the main page, eh?

There are over 21,000 members of this community; I would think we could come up with a better way of dealing with this problem. Sure we may not solve the problem completely but I bet all my stainless toys we can do better than “Read the reviews”!

What about virtually extending our hand to these folks, welcoming them to the community and kindly showing them the way of Eden? Why is it that folks knock these people down instead of setting good examples for the newbies?

Please feel free to comment, after all, that is what the forums are for. I welcome your opinion and encourage y’all to do so. I am sure we can make this a better place that everyone will enjoy being a part of.

PS, don’t worry, I am not going anywhere. It will take a whole lot more than this to get rid of me. less

Here's where I think the point is. I didn't, I'll admit, read the entire thread as of yet... but this is just my knee-jerk reaction.

When you started, did you know what was "appropriate to post?" Did you know that it would be looked on as point farming for asking a three word question? With 200 topics to post under, how did you know that your question had been answered or even which one to post under?

I am pretty sure that this is the reason that Kindred wanted to start a Big Brothers/Big Sisters type program. To have a member of the community reach out to someone as they registered for the program, introduce themselves, and to give them some guidelines and be available to answer some questions.

Whatever did happen to that idea? less

I remember when I first found the forums. I was like OMG where the hell do I start. It literally took me two days to find the question I asked. Thankfully a contributor led me in the right direction. There was not FAQ link back then. If not for the nice person that helped me I may have just stayed away.

Thanks for sharing your experience, that is what I am afraid of. We all know that words on a screen do not always show emotion or sarcasm. I know that I have felt much the same way when I speak my mind and others "Sound" harsh with their comments about what I have said. less

That's an amazing idea! I know the mentor program is available but that's for people who want to review. I know I tell my students that I can help them around the site (to figure out everything because I know it can be a bit overwhelming at first), but for those who don't plan on reviewing, a program like that would be fabulous! This is the first I heard of this. I like it! less

I know it, I freaked out too lol

Well, On another note Tim, I will say that at first-I was all about the points. I mean, who wouldn't be? I came here just browsing, and when I realized I got points for freebies, I was all about it! For the first few weeks I was all gung ho and doing as much as I could. When I started to actually read through the forums and deal with customer support on some of the orders I had placed, I started to realize just what an awesome place this was! I started to want to get more involved in helping others, and learning as much as I possibly could from others. It was pretty cool! After I realized all this, I started calming down and making sure that when I posted to the forums, it was going to be productive or something that was relevant.

It was told to me, that instead of getting upset or being negative with the new commers, to gently push them into the right direction as far as what we're about. If someone posts something that has already been posted, maybe link them to where that post is, to see if their answers are given there at that thread. Or tell them about the search engine above. When I first came here, I didn't realize that the search engine was for the forums while you're in the forums. I seriously thought it was just for searching products/shopping lol. less

I don't want to sound jerky but isn't is really easy to skip past the "obvious post farming stuff". I mean, if a title looks unappealing to a user, they could just not click it. Even if they did click it, it's super easy to click right back out of it? less

I agree.. Honestly, I have been guilty of telling people it's already been discussed and posting the link to it.

I hadn't thought of it that way, and I would hate to scare someone new away.
This was good post and definitely something worth reading entirely though.
Also, glad you are not running away. less

But, when you have limited time, and you go to the first page of the forum and it's filled with "Is this good?" "What is this like?" "Is this worth it?" all threads started by the same person in under 3 minutes, and then 5 more people do the same thing, it gets irritating.

Yeah, I don't click on them, but it's nice to be able to go to the forums and see interesting conversations. When I have to wade through obvious point farming, page after page, I have a right to get irritated. I've shut the computer and walked away at times, and I know I'm not the only one.

My point was that the forum also has to be inviting and interesting to the seasoned members of the community, too. Otherwise, where would be be?

In our haste to make newbies feel "welcome" (which I think for the most part they do) we don't want to alienate the seasoned members. less

But, when you have limited time, and you go to the first page of the forum and it's filled with "Is this good?" "What is this like?" "Is this worth it?" all threads started by the same person in under 3 minutes, and then 5 more people do the same thing, it gets irritating.

Yeah, I don't click on them, but it's nice to be able to go to the forums and see interesting conversations. When I have to wade through obvious point farming, page after page, I have a right to get irritated. I've shut the computer and walked away at times, and I know I'm not the only one.

My point was that the forum also has to be inviting and interesting to the seasoned members of the community, too. Otherwise, where would be be?

In our haste to make newbies feel "welcome" (which I think for the most part they do) we don't want to alienate the seasoned members. less

I agree with this completely. Like Gary had mentioned in one of his threads, it really is hard to tell whether a person is just new, or is point farming. I think the whole point farming thing has gotten really out of hand. I know your thread is about forum point farming but I also find that more and more people are complaining about how people are point farming by saying "thank you" on their reviews. I mean, really? That's just silly (in my opinion of course). less

Here's where I think the point is. I didn't, I'll admit, read the entire thread as of yet... but this is just my knee-jerk reaction.

When you started, did you know what was "appropriate to post?" Did you know that it would be looked on as point farming for asking a three word question? With 200 topics to post under, how did you know that your question had been answered or even which one to post under?

I am pretty sure that this is the reason that Kindred wanted to start a Big Brothers/Big Sisters type program. To have a member of the community reach out to someone as they registered for the program, introduce themselves, and to give them some guidelines and be available to answer some questions.

Whatever did happen to that idea? less

I see your point P'Gell. I guess I didn't really look at it from a perspective of a person who doesn't have lots of time like I do lol.. See, for me it's super easy to skip past the threads but I've also got plenty of time (no work right now and no children, etc). I wasn't trying to offend you. less

I know it, I freaked out too lol

Well, On another note Tim, I will say that at first-I was all about the points. I mean, who wouldn't be? I came here just browsing, and when I realized I got points for freebies, I was all about it! For the first few weeks I was all gung ho and doing as much as I could. When I started to actually read through the forums and deal with customer support on some of the orders I had placed, I started to realize just what an awesome place this was! I started to want to get more involved in helping others, and learning as much as I possibly could from others. It was pretty cool! After I realized all this, I started calming down and making sure that when I posted to the forums, it was going to be productive or something that was relevant.

It was told to me, that instead of getting upset or being negative with the new commers, to gently push them into the right direction as far as what we're about. If someone posts something that has already been posted, maybe link them to where that post is, to see if their answers are given there at that thread. Or tell them about the search engine above. When I first came here, I didn't realize that the search engine was for the forums while you're in the forums. I seriously thought it was just for searching products/shopping lol. less

Thank you, everyone! We really are here for you, the community, and we try to make things as painless as possible and as Tim said, it really does take time to get some things into place.

As far as the Big Brother/Big Sister program goes, we are tossing around a few ideas in this same vein along with Kinded's original idea. less

Oh, and maybe putting a character minimum for threads would be a good idea so we could get rid of the whole "I like it." "Cute." "Nice." and "Is this good?" threads. If you're going to start a topic you're usually going to at least explain what you're saying a little more than that. less

good idea, also for review comments. i hate taking the time to check out new comments on reviews to find "nice review" I expect a question or a conversational comment. i mean what am i supposed to do, reply everytime with a "thanks"

i'm glad this thread was started. I think it's good to give everyone a chance to vent and open the floor. Also the opportunity can be looked at as motivation for all of us to step up. To have pride in EF and our community.

Again i love the minimum word count idea less