Yet "another" discussion about review votes!

Carrie Ann Carrie Ann
So, I've been noticing something lately and I'm wondering if it's just me or if others see it too and how we can, maybe, fix it.

I'm noticing a lot of lower votes - not necessarily the lowest but useful or somewhat useful - for reviews where the person didn't like the product and the review is, perhaps, not as long as those that are positive about the product.

At least a few of them have had, as far as I can see, all the pertinent information we look for in a review - they were just short and not positive.

I'm not sure if I feel this is fair or just. I mean, we don't want reviewers lying about their experience or opinion of the toy, yet that is what may start happening if people are voting lower for less than positive reviews. People will feel compelled to say good things about something that didn't work for them. Yuck. I hate that idea.

So, tell me...

How do you vote when it comes to this type of review? Is a negative review useful to you? Can it be very useful?

How about review length? Do you tend to discount shorter reviews as less than useful? If a product plain old didn't work for someone and they include all pertinent info but little in the way of "extra" info and enthusiasm, is it/can it be extremely useful?

Whatcha think?
08/12/2010
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Alicia Alicia
Quote:
Originally posted by Carrie Ann
So, I've been noticing something lately and I'm wondering if it's just me or if others see it too and how we can, maybe, fix it.

I'm noticing a lot of lower votes - not necessarily the lowest but useful or somewhat useful - for ... More
To me extremely useful and useful are both "good" votes and sometimes I choose useful if I found the review hard to get through or it gave a description of the product without any kind of talking about how well it worked, I can tell what something is by the product info but I read the reviews to see how well it worked and how well it's made and stuff like that.

Sometimes I think a review on an item someone didn't like can be only "useful" or "somewhat useful" but only if they disliked it so much that they are not being objective or not really explaining why they didn't like it. If the person disliked it so much that they didn't even use it, then I can see that being only "useful" even if they described it because it's not really adding anything "extremely useful" for those that wouldn't mind whatever it was that made it unusable for the other person. But in general I think negative reviews can and mostly ARE just as useful as positive reviews, maybe even more so because you know it's an honest review and not an over exaggeration.
08/12/2010
Tori Rebel Tori Rebel
I generally try to go through a little who-what-where-when-wh y-and-how in my head when I write and when I read reviews to see if all bases are covered. If a review has all of those things, and enough detail to explain each, I will generally rate it highly whether it is positive or negative.

Incorrect spelling, grammar, and punctuation annoy me but I try not to let it effect how I rate the review because it's really not pertinent. However, if there is information in the review that is out-and-out incorrect (generally safety or cleaning info), or advisements that could be considered unsafe, I will consider that a bit of a strike against it, but with constructive criticism on said issue in the comments.
08/12/2010
Tori Rebel Tori Rebel
Quote:
Originally posted by Tori Rebel
I generally try to go through a little who-what-where-when-wh y-and-how in my head when I write and when I read reviews to see if all bases are covered. If a review has all of those things, and enough detail to explain each, I will generally rate it ... More
and I've tried to fix that 'wh y' in the first sentence twice and it won't let me LOL
08/12/2010
Alicia Alicia
I forgot review length..I think in general a shorter review length doesn't mean less useful to me but if it's so short because they're skimming over info and not giving much detail then that might be something I would vote "useful" over and not "extremely useful" but it wouldn't make me choose "somewhat useful" or anything.
08/12/2010
Darling Jen Darling Jen
I definitely don't see positive reviews as being more useful than negative ones. In fact, it's more useful to know which toys to remove from my wishlist than which ones to move higher.

I will admit I have to spend more time contemplating the information in shorter reviews than longer ones. But I try not to be guilty of quick judgement. No matter the length or tone of a review I ask, "Is there anything else I could possibly want to know about this product? Did it change or enhance my opinion? Was there information I wasn't even expecting but that I find super great to know?"

There have definitely been reviews that have successfully done it all with fewer words. And what more could you ask for when you can learn everything you'd need to know in less time?

But I agree that it seems to be an epidemic that more negative votes are being given out for less than positive reviews. The only thing that will help voters understand what to look for and grade on are topics in the forum like this though. I think it's a good start.
08/12/2010
Annemarie Annemarie
Quote:
Originally posted by Carrie Ann
So, I've been noticing something lately and I'm wondering if it's just me or if others see it too and how we can, maybe, fix it.

I'm noticing a lot of lower votes - not necessarily the lowest but useful or somewhat useful - for ... More
I rate negative reviews as I would positive reviews, or even neutral reviews.

Review length doesn't really have an effect, unless it's extreme. You can't really say everything you need to say in one paragraph.

I will say that leaving out an opinion completely does make it more "useful" instead of "extremely useful," as reviews are more answering the question "should I buy this? why?" and not "what are the facts about this toy?"
08/12/2010
P'Gell P'Gell
Quote:
Originally posted by Carrie Ann
So, I've been noticing something lately and I'm wondering if it's just me or if others see it too and how we can, maybe, fix it.

I'm noticing a lot of lower votes - not necessarily the lowest but useful or somewhat useful - for ... More
I wouldn't vote lower just because someone didn't like the product. I tend to like longer reviews with LOTS of data and description. I don't like to read a review and afterward start thinking, "Well, what was the toy made of? Can you use it for this or that? What was the size?" Stuff like that. And when people just say things like "It will make you cum like crazy." I can't vote, because there is no reason to know what will make ME "come like crazy." Also, improper syntax, a lot of misspelled words, too much slang or really subjective comments ("This toy is gross!") don't do much for me.

I tend to like reviews with a lot of description and some personal experience, with all the data about the product included. If this stuff is missing, I either don't vote or may vote slightly lower than if the review was more detailed. I'm a detail oriented person and like to read details, I guess. I also want the review to answer virtually all my questions about the product. That's why I read it in the first place.

But, no, if someone doesn't like a product and had good, descriptive reasons for not liking it, it won't cause me to vote lower at all.

A negative product can be QUITE helpful, if well written. It lets us know what to avoid or how a product can be changed to be more useful.
08/12/2010
TitsMcScandal TitsMcScandal
The tone of the review doesn't bother me. Positive, negative, neutral, all can be extremely useful to me. The length doesn't bother me if all the information is there. If it is super short (even with all the information) I may rate it as just useful instead of extremely useful due to my own personal like of style in reviews. I like to hear people's voices in their reviews, and with very short reviews you mostly don't get that, only the information.
08/12/2010
P'Gell P'Gell
If reviews state improper information "You can stick this in your ass." when it is NOT a safe anal toy, or if misinformation about the material or ingredients are part of the review, I also tend to either avoid the review or rate it slightly lower. I don't like to give "bad votes" and don't think I ever have. But, misinformation really bugs me.
08/12/2010
Alan & Michele Alan & Michele
A negative review can be very useful as long as the person elaborates a little. Like, instead of saying "I didn't like the vibrations." they said; "I didn't like the vibrations because they were too thuddy." Reason being is, what one person hates about a toy may be something that we're looking for in one, so we want to know the whys. Length is of no importance as long as the reviewer doesn't leave us with a lot of unanswered questions.
08/12/2010
gone77 gone77
I take each review on case-by-case basis. I like reviews that give plenty of pertinent information, whether the overall review is long or short-ish. I like when the reviewer shows off their personality in their writing as well. I give extremely useful votes for reviews that provide enough information and are well written. I also like for the reviews to keep my interest. No one wants to be bored by a review! lol

If I feel not enough information is present, I will vote either useful or somewhat useful, usually the latter. I vote lower than that only on certain reviews and rarely.
08/12/2010
ToyTimeTim ToyTimeTim
Positive and negative reviews can both be extremely useful or useful as long as the pertinent information is there. I have seen positive reviews were they just talk about what a big orgasm they have from using it, but no info on materials or lube compatibility etc. and they are really long, same goes for the negative. For these I will sometimes leave a comment, and give them time to fix it before I vote, sometimes I don't.


Sometimes it is a newbie and I will give them some slack if I feel they tried at least somewhat to get the information in there. Some I think are just uninformed as to what makes or brakes a review, the mentor program has been a big help with this and I feel that this should be the first thing offered to new people.

If it someone with like 10 reviews and they do not put in the information then I have no problem voting low, I feel they should know better.
08/12/2010
Pleasure Piratess Pleasure Piratess
Quote:
Originally posted by Alan & Michele
A negative review can be very useful as long as the person elaborates a little. Like, instead of saying "I didn't like the vibrations." they said; "I didn't like the vibrations because they were too thuddy." Reason being ... More
Thats exactly what I was thinking. I have read some negative reviews where I was still able to see that the toy would suit my interests because they explained exactly the shape, size, and performance. But when someone just says that something sucked or won't get you off, I wonder, how can they know what will get me off? As long as a review paints a picture in my mind of what it does and how it might feel, I'm happy, whether or not the reviewer was.
08/12/2010
Selective Sensualist Selective Sensualist
I greatly appreciate negative reviews. I never rate reviews lower just because the person did not like the toy. As a matter of fact, when there are several reviews for an item in which I am interested, I actually seek out the reviews with the lowest number of stars to learn about any potential downsides. As long as the reviewer addresses all of the pertinent information and explains WHY they did not like it, I consider this type of information to be exceptionally useful. If someone can explain WHY they did not like an item, I can compare their preferences to my own preferences and experiences to determine whether their reasons for disliking the toy are a non-issue for me.

So, please continue to give honest feedback!
08/12/2010
LuLu Love LuLu Love
I think there is nothing wrong with a review being "useful"; the majority of them should be. Only occasionally should one be rated as "extremely useful". Yet "useful" is treated as a four out of five stars rating instead of being a quality rating. "Extremely useful" should be more of a gold star on top of a quality review because it added something unique. I don't like how a useful vote can negatively affect rank either. It puts a big stigma on the rating that is obviously causing it to be brought up often. I definitely do think this should be addressed with some creative fix that Eden is always so good at
08/12/2010
Kayla Kayla
Quote:
Originally posted by Alan & Michele
A negative review can be very useful as long as the person elaborates a little. Like, instead of saying "I didn't like the vibrations." they said; "I didn't like the vibrations because they were too thuddy." Reason being ... More
Seconded. This is the reason I would downvote a review. Yes, "I don't like how this feels" is a valid part of a review. But for god's sakes, WHY? We're not all the same person. In order for a review to be useful, it has to includes the "whys" or it's just not useful. Yes, it's awesome to know if you liked it or not, but if you don't include the "whys", that review is now only applicable to you. I have no idea why you didn't like it, so I will just disregard your review.

As for length, I think it has something to do with it. I have a hard time believing that all of the "whys" can be answered with a shorter review. I've seen it once in awhile, but it's normally just not possible.

For me, an "Extremely Useful" review is something that answers virtually any question I have about the product. Were the textures different? Did they hurt? Shape? Size? Material? Soft? Gentle? Beginner-friendly?

Useful covers the vast majority of the bases, but doesn't dig into the details that I personally would want if I was looking to purchase the product. (I'm a picky little bugger when it comes to purchasing toys.)

Somewhat useful started into being a useful review, but it honestly covered only some of the basics. It needed more thought/information to be higher rated.

To me, most of the "Worth Reading, But Not Useful" reviews I've rated have either been general statements about the product type-reviews (Rabbit Vibrators are great for double-penetration. - Well, that's nice. Now what about this one in particular?) or have been reviews where the person basically gave a blow-by-blow account of their use of the toy. Worth reading because maybe you might find something useful, but it's so personalized that it's not generalized the vast majority of people.

Not Useful is used for something that I honestly think is just a waste of space or is obviously a fake review.

Really, review writing basically makes me think back to my Psychology classes. Your "experiment" has to be personalized and specific to what you are studying, but if you get TOO specific and personalized, it won't focus on the general audience that it is meant to apply to.

Yes. That's my take.
08/12/2010
Victoria Victoria
I vote based solely on effort - the writer has to be concise, detailed and somehow helpful. Length does not necessarily relate to detail. I have found brief but extremely thorough reviews.

Vote on content - the quality of that content.
08/12/2010
PassionQT PassionQT
Quote:
Originally posted by Victoria
I vote based solely on effort - the writer has to be concise, detailed and somehow helpful. Length does not necessarily relate to detail. I have found brief but extremely thorough reviews.

Vote on content - the quality of that content.
I agree.

Someone on here said to read every review as if that is the only you may ever come across, regardless of how many other reviews there are on the same product. It doesn't matter if they liked it or not, I still like see the descriptive angle and one's personal experience with it.
08/12/2010
Sensual husband Sensual husband
I think you have to remember if someone votes your review as useful and not extremely useful that does not mean your review was bad. When I am writing my review I hope people find them extremely useful but if they find it just useful that is ok as well. I also think negative reviews can be very useful and would rate them as so. I have not written a negative review yet but I could see where it would be a little harder to write a comprehensive bad review.
08/12/2010
Lady Venus Lady Venus
When I read a review, I don't read it as a reviewer...I read it as a customer. Assuming I have no idea the "ins and outs" of reviewing. "Would this review help me make my decision whether to buy it or not?" Then I make my vote. I look for the important factors, such as size, material, cleaning etc. I don't judge based grammar, it doesn't take good grammar skills to be a good reviewer.
08/12/2010
SydVicious SydVicious
I have noticed that shorter reviews get lower ratings, and I think that people thing because it's not a super long review that It doesn't have all the info needed. I have had a couple reviews that I had a hard time writing a super long review for. I just try to make sure that a review has at least the basic specs of the toy.
08/12/2010
~LaUr3n~ ~LaUr3n~
Let's say a review has almost all the info but is positive, I'd probably give it a SWU, or U vote, but the same length and amount of info for a negative review will usually get a U or EU vote from me.

I tend to be more lenient on a neg review. I feel it is much easier to explain why somehting is not buy worth than it is to really sell it above the rest if it is pos.
08/12/2010
Sammi Sammi
I think both positive and negative reviews can be equally useful. As to length, quality over quantity - just because a review is short, doesn't mean it doesn't have all the information necessary to make it extremely useful.
08/13/2010
Envy Envy
If a review is negative and gives accurate info about why it's negative then i will rate higher. i rate based on the info provided, not just about the experience of the user per say and how it did or did not work with them. If that makes any sense.

Besides, i tend to read the lower rated reviews of something first to see why people didn't like it, then compare to why people did like it, and I try to rate with what I think is fair. But short reviews that are nothing but smut just are not a good review to me, sorry. Or reviews that just talk about what features they wished the item DID have and not discussing what it really was.
08/13/2010
Heartthrob Heartthrob
Quote:
Originally posted by Carrie Ann
So, I've been noticing something lately and I'm wondering if it's just me or if others see it too and how we can, maybe, fix it.

I'm noticing a lot of lower votes - not necessarily the lowest but useful or somewhat useful - for ... More
In any review, I look for important info. If the review has everything it needs but is not favorable towards the toy, I will give it a useful to extremely useful vote. I don't think it's necessary to vote down unless the review itself seems incomplete and is missing information.
08/13/2010
Waterfall Waterfall
Both positive and negative reviews are important to me because I am looking to gain more information about the toy. I wouldnt give a bad rating to a review about something a person didnt enjoy,as long as they are providing enough information about various aspects of the toy(whether positive or negative)then I tend to find the review useful or extremely useful.
08/13/2010
YoungCouple YoungCouple
I have noticed the exact same thing as the OP. Some negative reviews get jumped on. As for the length, I definitely think that shorter reviews are not as good as longer, but some of the extended template reviews get REALLY long.

I think the most important thing about the reviews are the personal descriptions of experience, and a good experience review should be 2-4 paragraphs in my mind (Of course i also write erotica, so my advice is worth what you paid for it).

Then add 2-6 paragraphs to cover the major topics: Material, Packaging, Shape and Size, Uses, Cleaning, Compatibility, His and Her's uses etc. And i just don't see most of the short reviews telling me what i want to know. But if a short review is 100% experience based I still give it a good rating, I can read about compatability etc in the product descriptions.

Things that could help the quality of reviews:

1. Only very highly rated reviewers should be able to vote on advanced reviewer upgrades.

I have only been advanced for a few weeks but I take it VERY seriously and my writing reflects that. I see a lot of reviewers who need mentoring go right to advanced.

2. Review voting should be anonymous if we want to retain quality reviews.

This is tough because you can get trolls etc that down vote, but i think it helps people feel free to give their honest opinions.

3. There should be an easy and confidential way to give feedback on a review, and then change your vote once the review is updated

I would envision this as sort of a community mentoring experience. This could also take the form of a journal peer-review process. Giuve the community an opportunity to give some comments BEFORE posting. Like fix this grammatical error, or "hey you forgot lube compatibility". Or the most common for me "You spent 10 paragraphs describing the toy and then spent two sentences on how it felt in use"
08/13/2010
Kindred Kindred
I actually really appreciate the somewhat negative reviews, especially if it stands out against other reviews that are positive. The negative reviews usually give me some insight as to what I might not like about it that a positive review may not cover.
08/13/2010
Carrie Ann Carrie Ann
Quote:
Originally posted by YoungCouple
I have noticed the exact same thing as the OP. Some negative reviews get jumped on. As for the length, I definitely think that shorter reviews are not as good as longer, but some of the extended template reviews get REALLY long.

I think the ... More
We used to do anonymous voting and it was very, very abused. Down-voting due to fighting, drama and arguments was the norm, where now it is the exception.
08/13/2010
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