What do you find offensive?

LicentiouslyYours LicentiouslyYours
Lately we've had several people contact us regarding terminology used in reviews.

Often, offensive terminology is used, not out of disrespect, but simply not being aware that some find certain slang or phrasing hurtful.

So, I thought, let's talk about it. I don't believe too many of us are particularly interested in offending people purposefully and would welcome the opportunity to learn. What better way to learn about particular terms that people find hurtful or offensive by starting a discussion in the forum where nobody is singled out or attacked?

Because this can be a particularly hot topic that stirs up what people are passionate about, I'd like to make a few suggestions:

1. Please do not reference a specific review you found offensive or a person who used an offending term. This is not meant to call anyone out or point fingers, but simply to educate. Generally specify the words or phrasing and perhaps explain a bit why you find it offensive. (Remember the internet is international and while the reason you find something offensive may seem obvious to you, it may not be even remotely familiar to someone from a different country or for whom your language is not their first language.)

2. Please do not argue with anyone who posts about something they find offensive. The point of this is to give people something to think about, not challenge or debate the legitimacy of the offense.
01/28/2010
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Sir Sir
Referring to tran- people with derogatory or incorrect terms is one that has been oddly coming up lately. People have sometimes said thing out of not understand or being uneducated on the subject, so they have said things that are completely offensive. Should I say the terms, or refrain from doing so? I would truly prefer to not.
01/28/2010
Sir Sir
Quote:
Originally posted by Sir
Referring to tran- people with derogatory or incorrect terms is one that has been oddly coming up lately. People have sometimes said thing out of not understand or being uneducated on the subject, so they have said things that are completely ... More
trans-*, excuse me. Now, I will add here that I say "trans-" as to not be noninclusive. Some people do not identify with the umbrella transgender identity, so I always personally say trans-.
01/28/2010
Adriana Ravenlust Adriana Ravenlust
I am not super easily offended. I'm not fond of the term 'fag/got' or implications that anal play = gay but I try to be reasonable. Compared to the rest of the internet, this site is both incredibly PC and PG (in terms of behaviours) and I sometimes think people expect others to be too accommodating.
01/28/2010
Sephymuffins Sephymuffins
This is just my opinion:

I've seen some fights between members here, not to mention I've even been in a fight as well. I believe to avoid most of this, people should just take things to PMs if it becomes heated; this way no one can join in. Plus, who wants to see that drama flooding a review page? It would be nice to have the voting system attached to the comments as well. Meaning, you cannot vote a review up or down without leaving a comment. Or hell, just make it so that a user cannot vote down on a person's review without leaving a comment! There's abuse between members with that voting system whether or not now you can see who votes, and that can sometimes cause arguments as well.

I'm not totally sure why people like to openly fight on here, but there's a lot of ego-battles and people take their rating and number of reviews/toys very seriously. I'm not saying everyone is like this, but I've been very rudely told I can't really speak since I'm a "newer" reviewer and have done less assignments. Certain people like that aren't the majority here on Eden, but like I said, people get too serious about this type of stuff and I honestly believe it's because critiquing is not really a common thing here.

I believe this community is more set on the actual reviews, becoming a reviewer, posting on the forums and getting free items monthly. There's no real emphasis on criticism. Perhaps Eden should focus somewhat more on criticism so that when a user critiques another user's review (and by critique and criticism I mean the respectful, nice kind) it won't be so foreign! I love reading the reviews here, but I'm also a writer and it's just part of the whole side of me that writes--I read over other people's work and see how they can possibly make it better.

Coming back to more of Laurel's point, so far, I have yet to read any reviews where the user used slang or anything of that sort to offend me. Sometimes people get offended over another user's opinions, which to me is pointless, because then they're itching to start a fight. I agree with what Laurel has said 100%, I just believe to avoid conflicts and avoid heated arguments, other steps have to be taken as well. No one is perfect here and there should be a mutual respect between members; different opinion, different rating or not. The only thing that offends me is the lack of respect and the abuse of many options on this site.

=)
01/28/2010
DONOTSHOPHERETHEOWNERISPSYCHO DONOTSHOPHERETHEOWNERISPSYCHO
Derogatory slang or insulting someone's body type, sexual preferences/fetishes (i.e. anal sex, BDSM, etc.), sexual orientation, gender status, relationship choices and such.

It's sometimes difficult to translate humor through text since you can't read someone's body language or pick up on voice inflection. You've got to be a little more careful when wording things because of this. It's best to avoid something that could be interpreted as rude or offensive. If you post something that upsets someone unintentionally, there's no need to get defensive about it. Simply apologize to them and reword it (if possible). If not, just leave a comment that apologizes for the offense.

For example: You don't really enjoy anal play/sex but are reviewing a product that could double as such.

You could say "I haven't tried this toy anally as it's not really my thing, but it seems like it would be safe for that purpose." OR you could just not mention it. It would not be appropriate to say "I know some people use this for anal, but that's so gross and I didn't use it for that because buttholes are for poop. Ew."

Of course, this is a pretty mild example and there have been much worse things said in the forums and on reviews.
01/28/2010
Miss Cinnamon Miss Cinnamon
I more often find myself in situations where I am reading a review (or even forum post) and seeing something that makes me think "Wow. That was kind of insensitive to a certain group of people," rather than "I personally feel offended and hurt by that." Maybe it's because I don't identify with many labels? For example, when I see someone using a derogatory term for homosexuals or transgendered individuals, I find it offensive on those individuals' behalves, not my own.

The things I find offensive, personally:

--"Made in China" listed as a con. I admit that I am SUPER biased in this, since it's a country (sort of) near and dear to my heart. I don't think that people realize that if it's shoddy worksmanship, it's not technically China's fault, it's the company's fault for being cheap. There are products made in China that don't contain lead or buttons that fall off... they're just less cheap to produce than the ones that do. Anyway, it's just indicative of a sweeping generalization--"All things made in China are crap"--that I find offensive. Not just because I disagree with it, but because it feels like an ignorant, arrogant, statement.

--Insensitivity towards less-curvy women. This doesn't make me mad, it just makes me sad. Even though hormonal birth control may have supplied me with slight curves that I'm not genetically entitled to, I still feel like a skinny, flat-chested woman inside. When I review something that's meant to be worn, whether it be lingerie or a harness, I try to include all body types into my review. I steer clear away from terms that favor one body type over the other. So when I see a review (or article or post) that suggests that curvier women are more desirable because only their bodies are realistically proportioned, I feel like I'm being called an anorexic, underfed, stick person.

Soooo not much, really. More often, what I find offensive is actual behavior on the site. Someone will give criticism on a review, and the reviewer will be so incensed at this criticism that the reviewer will proceed to yell at the voter, privately or publicly, until the voter either apologizes or ignores the complaints. This particularly annoys me when the reviewers themselves take pride in being critical voters. When questioned about their critical votes, they will claim that they're helping the reviewer grow. That's very good, but when these critical reviewers receives critical votes? They hound the voters down. Double standard much?

Of course, there are critical voters out there who can give AND receive critical votes and comments courteously. For these members of the community, I am thankful.

Finally, bullying of newer reviewers. This never happened to me. When I was new, the more experienced members of the site were great to me. I felt guided; I felt mentored. Now, however, I'm seeing a rise in disrespectful behavior from the veterans to the newbies. Not every newbie is a bad reviewer--we should be helping them out, not shouting them down!
01/28/2010
TitsMcScandal TitsMcScandal
I have seem some derogatory terms out there, but I don't believe that they are there to insult people. I think it is the reviewer being ignorant. Not that being ignorant is an excuse, but it is something to keep in mind. In my opinion the reviews that are out there to insult people are worse than the ones that unintentionally do it.

Someone above said that she has seen reviews that put curves on a pedestal, but I have also seen the opposite. I've seen the reviews that put the smaller sized women on as the 'better' people. It goes both ways with that one... I think both are just as offensive.

I try not to take offense, and very rarely do. I figure that the people who are being offense aren't the good reviewers and they wil drop this eventually...
01/28/2010
LicentiouslyYours LicentiouslyYours
Quote:
Originally posted by Sephymuffins
This is just my opinion:

I've seen some fights between members here, not to mention I've even been in a fight as well. I believe to avoid most of this, people should just take things to PMs if it becomes heated; this way no one can ... More
I appreciate your perspective Sephy, but I'd rather we didn't get off topic. I'd like this to be strictly about terminology that may be hurtful to others.

By offering up that information, we give others the opportunity to respect those views when, in the past there may have been a lack of respect due to simply being unaware.
01/28/2010
Miss Cinnamon Miss Cinnamon
Quote:
Originally posted by TitsMcScandal
I have seem some derogatory terms out there, but I don't believe that they are there to insult people. I think it is the reviewer being ignorant. Not that being ignorant is an excuse, but it is something to keep in mind. In my opinion the ... More
You're absolutely right! It doesn't matter if it's smaller, larger, or "average" sized women (or any other body type). Putting any one type on a pedestal can be offensive to everyone else. I wasn't saying that one was worse than the other, just that personally, that offends me.
01/28/2010
Gary Gary
This is an excellent thread. I do think that most of the time people say things that they are so used to hearing, that they have never really stopped to think about the specific meaning. So it is really cool how most of the time the community will calmly try to point out how something is an offensive term.
01/28/2010
Gunsmoke Gunsmoke
I have no idea what this is about - It's not that I'm not easily offended (I'm not), it's that people are entitled to their opinions - even prejudices. If you find something you don't care for, simply move on.

Maybe I'm missing something - but to me this is a non-issue.
01/28/2010
Victoria Victoria
Quote:
Originally posted by Adriana Ravenlust
I am not super easily offended. I'm not fond of the term 'fag/got' or implications that anal play = gay but I try to be reasonable. Compared to the rest of the internet, this site is both incredibly PC and PG (in terms of behaviours) and ... More
I totally agree, Adriana - for what we do here and the size of our community, we have very little drama and very scarce offensive content. We should be proud in all that we are collectively doing right too.

And to everyone, I am glad to see this thread - it really speaks to the depth of consideration the people here go to for each other.
01/28/2010
Lithaewyn Lithaewyn
Quote:
Originally posted by Miss Cinnamon
You're absolutely right! It doesn't matter if it's smaller, larger, or "average" sized women (or any other body type). Putting any one type on a pedestal can be offensive to everyone else. I wasn't saying that one was worse ... More
Do you find it offensive if a review mentions that the wearable item might fit a certain body type best? Not for aesthetics, but purely because it probably would fit better/more comfortably?
01/28/2010
Sephymuffins Sephymuffins
Quote:
Originally posted by LicentiouslyYours
I appreciate your perspective Sephy, but I'd rather we didn't get off topic. I'd like this to be strictly about terminology that may be hurtful to others.

By offering up that information, we give others the opportunity to respect ... More
I apologize if I got off subject. I realize now I was rambling about a whole different matter. Haha. Oh well, I wrote it at 5am this morning before work, so.
01/28/2010
TitsMcScandal TitsMcScandal
Quote:
Originally posted by Lithaewyn
Do you find it offensive if a review mentions that the wearable item might fit a certain body type best? Not for aesthetics, but purely because it probably would fit better/more comfortably?
I know I personally don't. That's one of the things I look for. However there are reviews out there that will put down certain body types. Saying that a certain product might not work if you have a larger/smaller frame is one thing, saying that a product would 'look disgusting on a fat chick' or 'it's made for real women with curves' is offensive.
01/28/2010
Miss Cinnamon Miss Cinnamon
Quote:
Originally posted by Lithaewyn
Do you find it offensive if a review mentions that the wearable item might fit a certain body type best? Not for aesthetics, but purely because it probably would fit better/more comfortably?
That actually counts as good product information in my book. I've tried on my share of lingerie and some of it just doesn't fit my body type or I could see how other body types could have troubles with the cut of the piece. That's the fault of the manufacturer, not the reviewer, and I appreciate it when the reviewer takes body type affinity into account. The key, I think, is to use objective, non-offensive language to say it.
01/28/2010
Jul!a Jul!a
I don't generally get offended easily but I've seen a few things that just made me shake my head and want to smack the person who wrote it. Not so much in the review of an item but more the comments. It offends me as a person who takes the time to come up with well thought out and written reviews to see somebody come waltzing on in and tell newer reviewers that they don't know what they're doing because they haven't been doing it long or when they just drop insensitive comments. Criticism is fine as long as it's constructive.

I hope I didn't get too off topic there.
01/28/2010
Carrie Ann Carrie Ann
I have to admit I find it offensive in some weird way when people say things like "this was too big for me cuz I'm a very thin person" or "my wife is small, she goes to the gym every day, so this might work better for larger women" or "I'm small, around 100 pounds, so this was never going to fit inside me".

Why? Because weight has very little to do with vaginal size.

And it rather sounds like larger women, women who weigh a bit more, must have huge, gaping, cavernous vaginas.

Bone structure may make a difference. But weight? Nope. I've seen tiny, teeny, super thin women take a fist. And plenty of larger ones who can't.

Not that it's a huge deal or going to make me freak out but it is something to think about.
01/28/2010
Jul!a Jul!a
Quote:
Originally posted by Carrie Ann
I have to admit I find it offensive in some weird way when people say things like "this was too big for me cuz I'm a very thin person" or "my wife is small, she goes to the gym every day, so this might work better for larger ... More
I agree with that. To me it's like the people who characterize a woman's appeal by how much she weighs completely ignoring the fact that weight actually means very little, it's all in height, body structure, and build. That gets me really riled up.
01/28/2010
Heartthrob Heartthrob
Quote:
Originally posted by LicentiouslyYours
Lately we've had several people contact us regarding terminology used in reviews.

Often, offensive terminology is used, not out of disrespect, but simply not being aware that some find certain slang or phrasing hurtful.

So, I ... More
I have found two things offensive on the site. The first is the mention of rape in reviews. I have seen a few reviews where the toy was used in what the reviewer called rape. Rape is not something that needs to be glamorized. Playful forced sex in a fantasy? Sure, but rape is a strong word and should not be used at any time.

Second, I have seen more than one review which talks about minors receiving toys. This is a disturbing new trend for me. You have to be at least 18 years old to review on this site and so, I feel it is inappropriate to mention minors using the products unless you mention that it is so quiet your children won't hear.

These are the only two things which I have found offensive.
01/28/2010
Sir Sir
The only reason, I will add, why I personally find such things offensive on this site is because it isn't what Edenfantasys stands for. Edenfantasys isn't a sex toy shop that's tolerant of discrimination like that, so it isn't something that should be in reviews.

About lingerie, however, I usually add in what my partner's body type is so that people know "this is the body type it looks good on" and I think of it on other body types too and add in, "It would look good on all body types," or "It wouldn't look good on all body types." Most of what I've received has been really nice and well structured, so it has all been "it would look good on all body types, regardless of any factors, keeping in mind the sizing chart" or something like that. I would think that such terminology is alright, yes? Or am I incorrect on that?
01/28/2010
Sir Sir
Quote:
Originally posted by Miss Cinnamon
I more often find myself in situations where I am reading a review (or even forum post) and seeing something that makes me think "Wow. That was kind of insensitive to a certain group of people," rather than "I personally feel offended ... More
I agree with everything you said.
01/28/2010
Viktor Vysheslav Malkin Viktor Vysheslav Malkin
Fat is a word I personally find offensive, I haven't really seen it in a review though, but I do not like it.

When it is used to describe a person that is. Really do not see how it can be used for describing a product.
01/29/2010
Alan & Michele Alan & Michele
As far as reviews, I saw one where a guy referred to a transgendered person as "It" and I found that extremely offensive.

The other thing that both Alan and I find offensive is the tag that EF has in place for "Middle aged couples." What? Do we Fu** so differently than everyone else that we need our own label? If that's true, then why is there no separate tag for "Twenty Somethings?"
A friend of ours has an issue with the "Baby Boomers" tag for the same reasons.
01/29/2010
Sundae Sundae
Quote:
Originally posted by Alan & Michele
As far as reviews, I saw one where a guy referred to a transgendered person as "It" and I found that extremely offensive.

The other thing that both Alan and I find offensive is the tag that EF has in place for "Middle aged ... More
I think there are a few kinks with the tagging that could do to be worked out as well, generally I find myself a bit stumped when it comes to picking tags. However, you raise a good point. In fact, I don't think I've ever tagged a review for 'middle aged couples' because just as you said, I don't know what makes them different from any other couple around the place!
01/29/2010
Victoria Victoria
Tags have been being re-worked for a few weeks now. We definitely agree they need some changes, and we even asked in a different thread a few weeks ago for suggestions. Expect to see new and more intuitive tags in a few weeks.

Thanks!
01/29/2010
Owl Identified Owl Identified
Quote:
Originally posted by Miss Cinnamon
I more often find myself in situations where I am reading a review (or even forum post) and seeing something that makes me think "Wow. That was kind of insensitive to a certain group of people," rather than "I personally feel offended ... More
Just a thought, because I don't know specifically who you are referring to, but they might list "Made In China" as a con because they do not regulate labor in China. I know that when I see "Made In China" I am turned off because China has a rampant sweat shop problem/other labor issues and I don't like the idea of my sex toys being made by workers that are being mistreated. Again, I don't know what review you are referring to so they might not have even meant it in this way.
01/29/2010
Owl Identified Owl Identified
Quote:
Originally posted by Alan & Michele
As far as reviews, I saw one where a guy referred to a transgendered person as "It" and I found that extremely offensive.

The other thing that both Alan and I find offensive is the tag that EF has in place for "Middle aged ... More
I do have to admit that I also think those tags are not so useful. I don't think that age necessarily implies an interest in certain kinds of toys. I'm glad that we have the option of adding our own tags and I'm also pleased to see Victoria's comment about re-working tags.
01/29/2010
Kayla Kayla
Quote:
Originally posted by Alan & Michele
As far as reviews, I saw one where a guy referred to a transgendered person as "It" and I found that extremely offensive.

The other thing that both Alan and I find offensive is the tag that EF has in place for "Middle aged ... More
I always took "middle aged couples" to mean "This will be a great product to spice up your sex life". And they sorta have twenty-somethings. I like to consider that "College students". Either way, the tags are confusing.

As for what offends me? I live and date a crossdresser, so rude references to that. Like others have said, any "superioristic" weight comments since I'm a bigger girl myself. I'm not sure I'd be personally offended by the word "Fat" unless it was used like "Well, if you're fat, this won't fit you". But I describe myself as fat sometimes because I am.

I also take extreme annoyance to bragging. I don't know if you'd call it offensive, but it instantly turns me off of reading the review. Stating facts like you have a larger-than-average penis is one thing. Spending the next paragraph talking about how it never works for toys but the "ladies love is" is bound to make me hate your review. Gah. Same with people who work in the sex industry. I have no problem with their profession - I promise. I just hate when they bring it up in their review like nine times if it doesn't have a reason to be there. Like "Since I'm a web cam girl, I loved this toy". It makes me feel like they're telling me they are superior to me somehow.
01/29/2010
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