Need help with insertion...

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Need help with insertion...

T&A1987 T&A1987
My girlfriend and I have been trying to have sex and it doesn't seem to work. We've had a lot of problems, things like where to put the knees, how to put it in and how to know if it's gone in. She's been using a dilator set to increase the opening's circumference, but it hasn't helped much. We've also tried different positions, but nothing seems to go in, or if it does, there's no way to tell. The only sensation I felt is a slight increase in warmth, is there any way to tell if it actually goes in? i know that probably sounds silly sort of like "if you're in, you'll know it" but seriously, is there a way to know if you're in? it feels like i'm pushing against something and it won't go any further. sometimes it curves. I'm not sure if it's because shes too tense, i'm not firm enough, it's not open enough or what. any suggestions appreciated.
08/12/2012
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Kindred Kindred
Quote:
Originally posted by T&A1987
My girlfriend and I have been trying to have sex and it doesn't seem to work. We've had a lot of problems, things like where to put the knees, how to put it in and how to know if it's gone in. She's been using a dilator set to ...
There may be several reasons.

What is your erect length and girth? The average erect penis is 5" long and about 3.5-4" in circumference. A larger penis may have difficulty inserting due to size.

The average vagina is a few inches deep (you should be able to touch the cervix with your fingers inserted. Vaginal diameter varies. It might be that your partner has a small/narrow opening. If so, you can try warming her up with smaller toys first and then try penetration.

If you're unsure if you are penetrating her, try a position where you can visualize it. Try having her on her back at the edge of the bed with her legs up and you standing. In this position, you should be able to see if you are penetrating her.

Make sure you use lots of lube. Once inserted, you should feel warmth and pressure along your shaft. As you thrust, you should feel pleasurable sensations such as when you masturbate.

If you continue to have issues, it's unlikely there is anything wrong but you may want to consider each seeing a doctor to make sure there is nothing physically interfering with you having sex.
08/12/2012
Petite Valentine Petite Valentine
This suggestion may seem awkward, but once you are both sufficiently aroused try the Flower Press position (#3 on the linked page) or the V-formation position (#4 on the linked page — or pretty much what Kindred said above) in a well-lit room.

Either position should help open up your partner, and in a brightly lit room you should be able to see clearly whether you achieve penetration or not.
08/12/2012
T&A1987 T&A1987
Quote:
Originally posted by Petite Valentine
This suggestion may seem awkward, but once you are both sufficiently aroused try the Flower Press position (#3 on the linked page) or the V-formation position (#4 on the linked page — or pretty much what Kindred said above) in a well-lit ...
We tried the one where we lie back at opposite parts of the room and try to insert, but it always felt like the angle was wrong. It would seem like it was going in, but it would actually be curling up to the other part of the vagina. Is there some trick to the angle? point it down? up? leave it the same?

Is it possible that two bodies could just be incompatible? If so, why would anyone wait more than a few weeks before testing for sexual compatibility?

Also, is the whole process supposed to feel so unsexy? It either feels like there's too much pressure, too silly or jokey, or just aggravating because it seems like everyone's able to figure this out, except me. it's almost a catch-22 where i won't be able to even get in without experience, but I'm never going to have experience if i can't get in.

I know people are going to say "not to think about it" but I tried and can't not think about it. Besides, teenagers figure this out without problem, everyone figures it out, who couldn't think about being the one person who can't figure out A into B?

Seriously, why is this so hard, what am I doing wrong?
08/12/2012
T&A1987 T&A1987
Quote:
Originally posted by Kindred
There may be several reasons.

What is your erect length and girth? The average erect penis is 5" long and about 3.5-4" in circumference. A larger penis may have difficulty inserting due to size.

The average vagina is a few ...
about average length and below average girth, not 3-4 inch circ, although erectness does vary. the time between getting erect to trying to insert weakens it quite a bit. we tried warming up with smaller toys (well lubed) but it didn't work. We either kept missing, or it went in the first part, but the inner areas were tightened, or there just wasn't any sensation and I've been doing it right this whole time, but felt nothing. I've tried looking, but everything kind of gets lost amongst the skin and hair.
08/12/2012
Gracie Gracie
Looks like you've gotten some good advice. I am going to add another suggestion. As you probably know female arousal produces lubrication and increases the elasticity of the vaginal tissues. So when the the female is aroused it is much easier to accommodate her partner. So my advice is to make her orgasm at least once or twice before you attempt penetration.
08/12/2012
Petite Valentine Petite Valentine
Quote:
Originally posted by T&A1987
We tried the one where we lie back at opposite parts of the room and try to insert, but it always felt like the angle was wrong. It would seem like it was going in, but it would actually be curling up to the other part of the vagina. Is there some ...
"we lie back at opposite parts of the room"

I'm not quite sure what you mean.

"Is there some trick to the angle? point it down? up? leave it the same?"

Everyone is unique, and it takes a little fine tuning to find the "just right" position for both of you. But that will come later. For now, if you're unsure of whether or not you're penetrating your partner, then you need to be at an angle that will allow you to see what is happening— she can use her hand to guide you in while you watch. That should clear up any mystery as to whether you're in the right spot or not.

"Is it possible that two bodies could just be incompatible?"

Barring an extreme physical anomaly, no.

"Also, is the whole process supposed to feel so unsexy?"

Frustration can make everything unsexy. Try to remain upbeat, and if you feel arousal slipping away and that you're becoming aggravated, take a break and do something else.
08/12/2012
Kindred Kindred
I'm confused by your descriptions such as 'curling up to the other part of the vagina' and 'it went in the first part and the inner areas were tightened.' If your erect penis is of average length and girth, you should be able to insert the full length and easily visualize it. You need to first determine if it's truly a problem with insertion or sensation, because the solution will be different. If maintaining an erection is an issue, you may want to try a cock ring to help figure out what the issue is. It will at least eliminate if the issue is due to a loss of erection. Beyond that, I'm not sure what more help we can be without the use of graphic pictures illustrating what you are seeing.
08/13/2012
Zandrock Zandrock
I think I know what you mean by curling up. This sometimes happens with me and my girlfriend. If your girlfriend is tight it feels like you cannot insert. It feels like you hit a wall and you cannot push in any further. What needs to happen then is you need to stop sex, go back to foreplay and use lube. Start with one finger in her, then move to two. Then insert a finger with some lubricant on it, and place some on your penis as well. Just enough for a light coating (I prefer silicone lubes they last longer).

The feeling of her vagina will typically be wet, warm, and vaguely similar to when you masturbate.

I think missionary is the best with lights on. Help her guide you into her. She knows where her vagina is. Once she has your penis at the opening slowly push forward. You know you are in for sure when you pubic bone is touching her pubic bone (That little mound of fatty tissue at the top of your penis and a bit higher than her clitoris.

Hope that helps.
08/13/2012
Khanner Khanner
I second the suggestion to let her use her hands to insert you.

The thing you're pushing against might be her pubic bone.

It's a lot closer to the vagina than that picture makes it seem, though. It should be along the anterior ("top") wall, pretty close to the entrance. If you think you're hitting it, try angling downward (toward her tailbone)

Frustration is a total mood-killer, too. While you're both getting used to sex, don't go in with the expectation that it'll be amazing and you'll both instantly cum your brains out. Focus on the experience and have fun exploring. It's awkward right now but you're making fond memories. Also make it clear that you can stop any time, and you should stop if it hurts too much. Pushing past the pain is for exercise, not sex.

It's not an exact science, but you'll get the hang of it. You'll get used to each other's bodies and things can only get better.
08/13/2012
T&A1987 T&A1987
Quote:
Originally posted by Zandrock
I think I know what you mean by curling up. This sometimes happens with me and my girlfriend. If your girlfriend is tight it feels like you cannot insert. It feels like you hit a wall and you cannot push in any further. What needs to happen then is ...
she's tried guiding it in, but it either doesn't go in right, or it doesn't stay in, or something. I think I went in for a bit last night, but it was painful for her and movement or thrusting caused pain. We've tried missionary, but it's hard to position, know where to put the knees, hold my body up and the whole rigamarole kills the erection pretty quickly.
08/13/2012
novanilla novanilla
Does she have a hymen that covers her whole opening? A friend of mine had this and it requires a surgery. If she also has had problems with tampons, that could be a problem. Have her ask a doctor to look at her hymen and see if this is the problem. I assume you are both virgins if you're having this problem.
08/13/2012
Petite Valentine Petite Valentine
Quote:
Originally posted by T&A1987
she's tried guiding it in, but it either doesn't go in right, or it doesn't stay in, or something. I think I went in for a bit last night, but it was painful for her and movement or thrusting caused pain. We've tried missionary, but ...
If I remember correctly, in a previous thread you said she has penetrated herself with toys so I think the issue might be that she's either insufficiently aroused and/or lubricated when you attempt penetration. It's my best guess since "or something" and "I think" give us little information to work with.

If finding a comfortable position where you can watch her guide your penis in is problematic, try letting her penetrate herself with a toy while you watch. This will clear up any mystery about her anatomy, show you the angle you should aim for when you penetrate her and should also dilate the vaginal opening.
08/13/2012
asandahl asandahl
look and see if it is in.
08/17/2012
Bill220 Bill220
Maybe try and enter her from behind? That way you can see what's going on down there. As mentioned, use lots of lube and above all, try and relax. Getting nervous and/or frustrated kills my erection like nothing else.
If you think that the issue is more because you aren't erect enough, maybe go to the Dr. and get a script for Cialis. Stuff works great. When my wife and I want to have hours of sex I'll use Cialis. If not, I'm one and done, LOL.
08/17/2012
T&A1987 T&A1987
For everyone that has suggested to look and see if it's in, that doesn't work. Between the hair, skin and body, it's nearly impossible see anything. Plus I get the feeling that it goes in, but gets blocked about half an inch in, so it really doesn't matter matter if it's in, because it's not going in all the way.
08/17/2012
Petite Valentine Petite Valentine
Quote:
Originally posted by T&A1987
For everyone that has suggested to look and see if it's in, that doesn't work. Between the hair, skin and body, it's nearly impossible see anything. Plus I get the feeling that it goes in, but gets blocked about half an inch in, so it ...
"For everyone that has suggested to look and see if it's in, that doesn't work."

Then you need to switch positions. Or reach down and gently spread the labia so that you can see the vaginal opening. Hair should not be an issue. If you look at the first picture posted on the Wikipedia entry for "Vulva" (NSFW) the labia are still visible. Wikipedia commons also has a picture of an unshaven vulva with the labia spread (NSFW) (i.e. you can see the vaginal opening). If you need something labled, there is this picture (NSFW).

If you cannot tell us precisely what's going on, then we're all going to continue to go in circles because there is no way to know if the problem is an obstruction, a matter of alignment, a matter of arousal (hers or yours), or worst case scenario, you're mistakenly trying to penetrate the urethral opening which would cause her pain and damage that will require a trip to the doctor.
08/17/2012
charletnarouh charletnarouh
If she's too tense for you to insert your index finger, she's way too tight for PIV sex. If she can't relax enough for you to finger her, then she's either got some vaginismus going on, an obstructive hymen, or she's just really tense which is mental and emotional. She should see a doctor just in case it's one of the first two. I'd really recommend that you take PIV sex off the table for a while. Have lots of oral and manual sex. Make love without having intercourse. Learn what it takes to make her really turned on, to make her have an orgasm, or three. From the sound of things, you're fairly inexperienced with each other sexually so learning each other is a big step. Basically, have lots of "lesbian" sex. Once you understand how her body works, know it intimately with your hands and mouth and eyes, know what kinds of touches and pressures she likes, and even know how she's angled and shaped internally, and likewise, vice versa, her knowing your body as well, you can try and tackle PIV again with more success. Learn to feel sexy with each other. Sex is supposed to feel sexy. There is so much you can do without putting your penis in her vagina that will help you both get to know each other sexually and feel more comfortable with each other emotionally. Try to work through any barriers that are between you. Be naked together, touch each other everywhere, shower together, watch each other masturbate to learn what you each like, have oral and manual sex where the receiver instructs the giver on what they like and want, play with toys. If she likes her smaller dildos and is comfortable inserting them, have her insert it and play with it while you watch and then take over manipulating it for her. Once that's comfortable, try a larger one. Right now, it sounds like you don't know each other physically very well and you are also really feeling the pressure to make this PIV stuff work when you really need to just back off and get to know each other and yourselves a little better in this context. Work on doing all the little things that make you each feel sexy to yourselves and each other. Give her some money and let her go buy some sexy lingerie or clothes that make her feel sexy and then take them off with your mouth. Take her out to dinner while she's wearing some sexy underwear under her clothes, then go home and enjoy undressing her. Have a bubble bath together with some bubble bath stuff you both like and some candles, eat chocolate, better yet, eat chocolate off each other, drink wine or whatever you like to drink. Give each other massages. Be sexual with each other without actually having intercourse. Maybe read some sexy erotic stories or watch porn together if you both like those things. Send each other sexy text or voice mail messages, if you can do so without getting in trouble at work or what have you. Minus the pressure, add the sexy, and I bet you'll both be much happier and your sex life will improve. And NEVER underestimate the value of TALKING! Communicate, over-communicate. You can't communicate enough. Ask her how she's feeling, not just physically, about sex. Ask her what she thinks about. Ask her about her fantasies and what turns her on. Ask her what's going on in her head when you guys try and have sex and it doesn't work. My gf and I find that we like to have deep conversations in the bath together. Something about the intimacy of the bathtub with some candles and low lighting and a glass of wine, being naked together, holding each other in the water, lets both of us open up more freely. Anyway, main point is, relax, don't worry about the PIV stuff, get to know each other in every possible way, work through barriers, my guess is, the issue you're having will work itself out. If in doubt, seek out a therapist who specializes in sex and relationships.
08/17/2012
charletnarouh charletnarouh
Quote:
Originally posted by charletnarouh
If she's too tense for you to insert your index finger, she's way too tight for PIV sex. If she can't relax enough for you to finger her, then she's either got some vaginismus going on, an obstructive hymen, or she's just really ...
Also, using a hand held mirror might help to be able to see better if you're really struggling with visual confirmation of penetration.
08/17/2012
T&A1987 T&A1987
Quote:
Originally posted by Petite Valentine
"For everyone that has suggested to look and see if it's in, that doesn't work."

Then you need to switch positions. Or reach down and gently spread the labia so that you can see the vaginal opening. Hair should not be an ...
It's not that i'm trying to penetrate the urethra, I can find the opening before I put my penis in, but when I do it, I think it either gets blocked by her tensing up, or it doesn't go in and and pushes up into the upper part of the vagina. When she puts it in, her arm presses into my body making it hard to see anything that's happening. I've gone in once or twice, but it was too painful for her.

As for the waiting, one it's not like we try this every night until she's too sore to move. We started again about two months ago, tried twice, failed and took a month and a half off before trying again last week. I know "wait, take a break, you'll get it" sounds like good advice, but we've tried that, and after four years, it hasn't worked yet. doing something seems more productive than doing nothing, even if it's just a little something.
08/18/2012
Kindred Kindred
Quote:
Originally posted by T&A1987
It's not that i'm trying to penetrate the urethra, I can find the opening before I put my penis in, but when I do it, I think it either gets blocked by her tensing up, or it doesn't go in and and pushes up into the upper part of the ...
If this is an issue that you have been trying to deal with for 4 years, I would suggest that the next step is for your partner to see a gynecologist to determine if there is a medical reason for what you are experiencing. No one on these forums is really going to be able to help further since we lack the intimate details and the medical knowledge.
08/18/2012
P'Gell P'Gell
Quote:
Originally posted by T&A1987
We tried the one where we lie back at opposite parts of the room and try to insert, but it always felt like the angle was wrong. It would seem like it was going in, but it would actually be curling up to the other part of the vagina. Is there some ...
Kindred has given you some good advice. (I'm glad you felt comfortable enough to bring this to the Community, I know people will want to help. This situation is actually more common than people talk about.)

I can't approach it from a man's POV, but as a woman, I can tell you some things. She can help. She can hold her inner lips open and hold your penis with her other hand and guide you in (I still often to this, and My Man and I have been having sex with each other for well over 20 years)

Also, aim towards her spine as you enter her, as the vagina angles towards her back. Lube is essential, and sometimes it's hard to get "just enough." We've actually found too much and he slips out! But, Frottage (rubbing genitals together) is also fun and a nice way to get warmed up.

I'll try to find a diagram so you'll see what I mean.
08/18/2012
P'Gell P'Gell
Quote:
Originally posted by Kindred
If this is an issue that you have been trying to deal with for 4 years, I would suggest that the next step is for your partner to see a gynecologist to determine if there is a medical reason for what you are experiencing. No one on these forums is ...
I agree. There are medical conditions that can make penetration difficult, painful or even impossible until they are treated. She really should see a GYN to make sure everything is in order. If it is not, there is treatment for things like imperforate hymen (meaning a hymen that is not open and has a veil of tissue covering the entire vaginal opening) or vaginismus (a tightening of the muscles of the vagina which prevents penetration) and other conditions.



As you can see, the vagina angles strongly towards the spine.
08/18/2012
Petite Valentine Petite Valentine
Quote:
Originally posted by Kindred
If this is an issue that you have been trying to deal with for 4 years, I would suggest that the next step is for your partner to see a gynecologist to determine if there is a medical reason for what you are experiencing. No one on these forums is ...
If you read through the earlier thread T&A1987 posted about this issue, the girlfriend "has been able to have toys and a speculum inserted without problem." I don't think a physical abnormality is preventing intercourse.
08/18/2012
Kindred Kindred
Quote:
Originally posted by Petite Valentine
If you read through the earlier thread T&A1987 posted about this issue, the girlfriend "has been able to have toys and a speculum inserted without problem." I don't think a physical abnormality is preventing intercourse. ...
Unless she has been examined by a gynecologist knowing that there is potentially a problem, you can't rule out that there is an issue. A general exam is not necessarily going to evaluate for all possibilities.
08/18/2012
Petite Valentine Petite Valentine
Quote:
Originally posted by Kindred
Unless she has been examined by a gynecologist knowing that there is potentially a problem, you can't rule out that there is an issue. A general exam is not necessarily going to evaluate for all possibilities.
You believe that she has a physical abnormality that allows her to penetrate herself with a dildo and allows a doctor to insert a speculum, but that prevents her boyfriend from inserting his penis?

I guess anything is possible, which is why I used the word "think" in my response, and I referred specifically to a [bold:physical abnormality]. I have no doubt there is an issue, but my non-medical, layman's opinion is that it's not an obstruction, and not even necessarily with her. I think they should both be examined by a doctor, who can give them a diagnosis, a prognosis, and if necessary refer them to a sex educator / counselor / therapist who can assist them.
08/19/2012
Kindred Kindred
Quote:
Originally posted by Petite Valentine
You believe that she has a physical abnormality that allows her to penetrate herself with a dildo and allows a doctor to insert a speculum, but that prevents her boyfriend from inserting his penis?

I guess anything is possible, which is why ...
I don't necessarily think there is a physical obstruction. It could be a physiologic obstruction. My point is, they have been dealing with this for 4 years. They need to start from the beginning and rule out a medical condition before getting more advice from community members that may lack the medical knowledge and the ability to examine the two of them.
08/19/2012
Petite Valentine Petite Valentine
Quote:
Originally posted by Kindred
I don't necessarily think there is a physical obstruction. It could be a physiologic obstruction. My point is, they have been dealing with this for 4 years. They need to start from the beginning and rule out a medical condition before getting ...
Point taken, I apologize if I was prickly. I agree with what you say about ruling out a medical condition, but I think a visit to the doctor is something they should both do. She should see a gynecologist, and he should see a urologist — preferably together so they can discuss their concerns with the doctor as a couple.
08/19/2012
Kindred Kindred
Quote:
Originally posted by Petite Valentine
Point taken, I apologize if I was prickly. I agree with what you say about ruling out a medical condition, but I think a visit to the doctor is something they should both do. She should see a gynecologist, and he should see a urologist — preferably ...
I agree that both should see a doctor. And I didn't take what you posted as prickly at all.
08/19/2012
charletnarouh charletnarouh
I agree. A visit to both doctors, together, for examination and to discuss the issue and if the doctors have no solution, a referral to a specialist or counselor of some kind is definitely in order. There's definitely something going on here that is out of the norm and needs to be evaluated and possibly treated by professionals.
08/20/2012
Total posts: 30
Unique posters: 11