Shemales, Lady Boys, Chicks with Dicks etc...

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Shemales, Lady Boys, Chicks with Dicks etc...

Champagne and Benzedrine (Roland Hulme) Champagne and Benzedrine (Roland Hulme)
Somebody mentioned 'futanari' earlier - the hentai genre with girls who have ridiculously over-sized penises. I was just wondering about the other, more mainstream eroticization of that - so-called 'shemales.'

Trannsexuals seem like a really popular genre in porn and I was just wondering what people's thoughts were about them. Is the so-called 'shemale fetish' demonstrated by all the trannsexual porn sites offensive to transgender people?

Does finding pre-op trannsexuals attractive mean a straight person isn't as straight as they thought they were?

I'll admit, the idea of a really, really feminine transexual - who basically looks like a beautiful woman apart from the fact she has a big, hard cock - is a fascinating if uncomfortable fantasy of mine. I claim to be straight - I always wonder what that exactly means.

I was just wondering what people though about the eroticization of transgender people. I'm be REALLY interested in what any transgender people thought of it themselves. It strikes me that a man who wants to be a woman, but is pre-op, would still prefer to be considered a woman and treated as a woman, rather than sexualized and fetishized for the fact that she still has a cock.
09/01/2009
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Quote:
Originally posted by Champagne and Benzedrine (Roland Hulme)
Somebody mentioned 'futanari' earlier - the hentai genre with girls who have ridiculously over-sized penises. I was just wondering about the other, more mainstream eroticization of that - so-called 'shemales.'

Trannsexuals seem ...
I have the same fantasies as you do. I'm straight but have had some encounters with females. I think women are beautiful and I do get turned on by them. That being said, there is no substitute for cock...so a beautiful woman who still had her penis is a huge turn on for me.

As for how the trans-gendered would feel about this, that is a good question. I would think though, that in the realm of fantasy and porn specifically, it's like apples and oranges, it's all about what turns you on. Do I feel offended that people like porn that is filled with really skinny women with fake tans and fake boobs? Do I get jealous or hurt that my fiance most frequently watches porn with Asian women or petite women in general and I'm 5' 10' and weigh over 200 pounds? Does he get angry when I fantasize about women or tall muscular black men with shiny shaved heads and large cocks, when he is an out of shape white man who is an inch or two shorter than me? No. Why? It's a FANTASY.

Sex is something that can be completely separate from emotions. I an attracted to women, but I would be less likely to be in a relationship with one. Not because of her looks, but because of how different women and men tend to be mentally and emotionally. Not that I couldn't learn to live with a female, but they tend to be a lot more "work" emotionally than men. This is the reason I keep very few female friends. I'm just a lazy person I guess...lol. Men, for me at least, have always been "easier".
Fantasies are where the lines of reality are often blurred if not altogether fictional and sometimes "out of this world". While I agree that it would be wrong for someone to seek out a relationship based on a certain fetish would be wrong, it's not unheard of. One of the first things that draw you to a person is sexual attraction. It's getting to know the person inside and wanting to share your life with them, that turns it in into a relationship.
I don't know. It's very interesting. I would like to hear how trannsexuals feel about this as well.
09/01/2009
spicywife spicywife
Quote:
Originally posted by Champagne and Benzedrine (Roland Hulme)
Somebody mentioned 'futanari' earlier - the hentai genre with girls who have ridiculously over-sized penises. I was just wondering about the other, more mainstream eroticization of that - so-called 'shemales.'

Trannsexuals seem ...
What you mention about a feminine female with a penis could be equal to the fantasy that is created during a pegging session - which I don't believe makes a heterosexual couple not so.
09/01/2009
spicywife spicywife
Quote:
Originally posted by spicywife
What you mention about a feminine female with a penis could be equal to the fantasy that is created during a pegging session - which I don't believe makes a heterosexual couple not so.
Also, I don't think a woman wanting to peg her male partner and wear a harness with a cock would make her transsexual. Perhaps heterosexuality is fluid and only means that you prefer a partner of the opposite sex, but it doesn't mean you aren't interested in all aspects of sexuality.
09/01/2009
Sir Sir
This is a very offensive topic.
09/01/2009
Victoria Victoria
I think it is quite common in a lot of porn for people's bodies, ethnicity, attributes and so on to be objectified and eroticized. It's kinda a given, right?
It's even mentioned in the posts above mine - about Asian porn, big black guy porn etc.

Just like movies and TV shows in the mainstream, people are cast to appeal to a niche and to stand out from the "rest". And just like in those cases, I believe it bothers those marginalized people. Now, for the people who are in the porn films, or on the TV shows - it may not be a big deal. They may actually see it as empowering to reach the masses and get work in entertainment. It's all in the eye of the beholder.

As for being more or less straight - honestly, my opinion on that one is: who cares? Who walks around with a gay/straight barometer that fluctuates with your fantasies? If you are comfortable in your own skin, and you feel good when you fantasize - then does it really matter?
09/01/2009
spicywife spicywife
Quote:
Originally posted by Victoria
I think it is quite common in a lot of porn for people's bodies, ethnicity, attributes and so on to be objectified and eroticized. It's kinda a given, right?
It's even mentioned in the posts above mine - about Asian porn, big black guy ...
Exactly, that was my point about how sexuality is fluid. A certain fantasy doesn't make you gay or not gay, etc.

I'm not sure if I understand why this topic is offensive though. I don't believe anyone was insulting anyone...
09/01/2009
Carrie Ann Carrie Ann
Quote:
Originally posted by Sir
This is a very offensive topic.
Could you maybe explain that further? I think that's what the original post/topic is asking for.

We see a plethora of transgender porn that is probably offensive to many who are transgender; and yet it's still made and sold and watched.

Why is it offensive?

And why do transgender folks make it/participate in it if it's offensive?
09/01/2009
Sir Sir
Quote:
Originally posted by Carrie Ann
Could you maybe explain that further? I think that's what the original post/topic is asking for.

We see a plethora of transgender porn that is probably offensive to many who are transgender; and yet it's still made and sold and ...
I'm not sure, since I don't consider myself to be in any of those categories. I'm not sure why transsexuals would do such a thing and market it as "she-males," or "chicks with dicks," because the whole point of being a transsexual is that you feel that you're the other gender.

The reason why you should refer to them as female, even if they use their masculine organs, is because they are female, they just prefer to use it sort of as if it's a strap-on (which there's nothing wrong with) I'm pretty sure. Then again, I could be completely wrong. People, honestly, are sometimes just odd. The way that they market themselves, however, I cannot speak for. It's offensive to me generally and I'm sure that they're degrading themselves by marketing themselves in such a way.

Transsexual porn isn't offensive in and of itself - the way that these people market themselves is. Like using terms such as those that were used and many more. That, to me, is what's offensive, not the actual porn aspect. Honestly, it's still just porn, be it with two women, two men, a man and a woman, a man and a transsexual woman, a woman and a transsexual woman, etc. etc. - it comes down to it being just porn. The marketing and terminology is what's offensive. Personally, I don't feel that it should be a fetish (because that's offensive too), but that's just personal opinion on that.

And no, straight people, if attracted to a transsexual, are still straight. If a man dates a transsexual woman (either pre- or post-operative), then he's still straight, because she's a female.
09/01/2009
Carrie Ann Carrie Ann
Thank you.

I agree that marketing is often offensive.

Hell, I get offended by most BDSM porn.

And yet people DO have these fetishes, as is proven by the sales (multi billion dollar sales) of products marketed in this way.

It's all just so odd...
09/01/2009
Champagne and Benzedrine (Roland Hulme) Champagne and Benzedrine (Roland Hulme)
Quote:
Originally posted by Sir
I'm not sure, since I don't consider myself to be in any of those categories. I'm not sure why transsexuals would do such a thing and market it as "she-males," or "chicks with dicks," because the whole point of being ...
Thanks for this - it's a fascinating perspective.

I'm always wary of accusing people of degrading themselves, especially people who make porn - that mirrors some of the anti porn rhetoric I hear. But I do appreciate where you're coming from - in some ways, transgender people who identify as female are 'selling out' by catering to the niche that sexualizes themselves something they don't identify with.

Are there transexuals out there who actually do identify themselves as - and are comfortable being - a woman with a cock? Who don't want to have the operation? A kind of 'third sex.' ?

That's what makes me feel weird about my fascination with the shemale genre. Being attracted to a transgender person - who is a woman, who just happens to have male genitalia - is different from being sexually stimulated by a woman BECAUSE she happens to have male genitalia.

But anyway. I guess ultimately it's no more offensive than the racial cliches in interracial porn, or my favorite annoyance - so-called MILF porn. Apparently if you're 30+ you're a milf, regardless of whether you've had a kid or not.
09/01/2009
Sir Sir
Quote:
Originally posted by Champagne and Benzedrine (Roland Hulme)
Thanks for this - it's a fascinating perspective.

I'm always wary of accusing people of degrading themselves, especially people who make porn - that mirrors some of the anti porn rhetoric I hear. But I do appreciate where you're ...
You're very welcome, to you and Carrie Ann.

And yes, I believe that there are some women who identify as that. There are also some transsexual men who see themselves in the "third gender" category, which is funny that you brought it up because I talked with someone about this recently.

You're definitely correct. Being attracted to a woman who just happens to have those organs is different from being attracted to her BECAUSE she has those parts, but sadly, most times this is the case.

And you're right again. It isn't any more or any less offensive than those things.
09/01/2009
spicywife spicywife
Wow. I'm definitely offended by MILF. I didn't know about that.
09/01/2009
spicywife spicywife
Everyone is offended by different things, which is why I try my best to use tact. It's hard when you are the one being offended because.. well, who likes to be offended?
09/01/2009
Not Here Anymore f/k/a Happy Lady Not Here Anymore f/k/a Happy Lady
This is a great discussion. It reminds me of conversations I've had about the use of the "n" word. [I hate that word] There are some rappers who use it freely, but there are other people who of all races who hate it.

Personally, I'm not offended by the term MILF when used in reference to me, but I have friends who are.
09/01/2009
Rockin' Rockin'
Oh my. The title of this thread really struck a nerve with me. I cringed.

I recently read a book called Whipping Girl by Julia Serano, who is a transsexual woman, a scientist, and an excellent writer. I encourage anyone with questions about transsexuality, transgender issues, and other related subjects to read the book. It was very, very enlightening to me.

A few things, and I'm mostly speaking solely from what I learned in Whipping Girl (i.e. I haven't personally talked to people to see what is/isn't offensive, I'm going off of what Serano wrote)...
-All the terms in the thread title are generally considered offensive (to transsexual females and quite possibly other people)
-"Third sex" and "Third gender" terms, while they may be claimed by some people, seem to be used primarily by cisgender / cissexual folks who want to distinguish themselves from people whose sexual/gender identities they do not understand and sometimes feel superior to
-Yes, there are people who only transition using gender expression techniques alone, hormones alone, or both expression and hormones to produce the look they want, without surgery
-Why would someone not want to have surgery? They may be fine with their bodies and feel {insert desired gender here} enough with the aforementioned changes. They may also weigh the expense and risks of surgery against their current situation and life fulfillment.

Serano also talked about the discrimination and general hardships faced by transgender/transsexua l folks in terms of employment and finances. She said many transsexual people (I'm not sure of the quote, but it was something like) "end up in the sex work industry because they have difficulty finding work elsewhere." Whether transsexual women are aware of the sexualization of their bodies or not post-production, Serano makes a strong case that the marketing of porn containing transsexual women is just awful, degrading, and sensationalizes the "female with a penis" concept with which the nation/world is so fascinated.

The concepts of sex, subconscious sex (commonly termed gender), and gender expression are all separate and deserve their own attention when attraction is brought into the conversation. Example: If a cissexual, cisgender woman likes a cissexual, cisgender male who dresses like a male, she'd likely be labeled with a different term regarding her sexual orientation than if she liked cissexual, cisgender males who dressed as women. I'd elaborate further, but I'd probably have to use even more labels, and I'm tired of those.
09/02/2009
Total posts: 16
Unique posters: 8