I'm a feminist, why aren't you ?

I'm a feminist, why aren't you ?

Chirple Chirple
It greatly disturbs me to see feminist hate, especially on EF.

Many people are afraid to call themselves feminists because it's become a dirty word.

Who WOULDN'T want equality for men and women and everyone else ?

Feminism is not about women being better or smarter or stronger or having more terrible problems. Feminism is about EQUALITY. Perhaps it's outgrowing the label as it bleeds into equality for ALL, for men and women AND others who are both/neither.

Feminism isn't about non-females being terrible bad people. It's not about MEN ARE THE DEVIL OMG. It's not about "let's distill them down to sperm and get rid of them because we don't need them".

I'm a white person, and you know what ? I actually really do have white privilege. That doesn't make me a bad person because it wasn't my choice - what would is if I pretended I didn't. The fact that I face oppression too doesn't change their reality.

Men definitely face some really shitty problems - but that doesn't make male privilege in our society go away. That doesn't mean we should ignore men's issues and work on women's first - it means we need to acknowledge and do our best to help EVERYONE. To overcome our own prejudices and hurtful paradigms, to overturn that which is holding ALL OF US back.

And "Male Privilege" isn't just about "dudes get it better". It hurts and degrades men, too.

Team effort, everyone.


Why aren't you a feminist ? What makes the word "dirty" to you ? If you don't want equality for women, why not ? What makes women lesser to you ?

Certainly, not all people who call themselves "feminists" are good people who actually support equality. But I could call myself an African Princess - but that would just be offensive and untrue, and so it is with those who call themselves feminists while forwarding their own hateful goals. And if I did such a thing, I certainly should not be treated as the voice of all princesses who happen to be African. That would just be silly.

If the words "bitch" and "slut" get to be reclaimed, why are we so reluctant and afraid to reclaim "feminist" ?

Maybe it is time to move on to a new word, to espouse equality not just for men and women, but for everyone. But it's growth, and it's not growth out of an evil feminism that wants to cut off all the dicks in the world and put them in a bag and light it on fire.
03/17/2012
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Errant Venture Errant Venture
I don't recall anyone on here being against feminism. I recall people being against militant feminism, as you point out, but not actual feminism.
03/17/2012
Chirple Chirple
Quote:
Originally posted by Errant Venture
I don't recall anyone on here being against feminism. I recall people being against militant feminism, as you point out, but not actual feminism.
O, just an article I read. I'm not trying to hate on it in particular - I don't want to direct negative attention at it since I don't think the writer meant direct harm, and I feel really bad for mentioning it because I really don't intend any ill-will, it just got me to thinking.

That and I see this attitude commonly outside of EF.

One "big" example is that Lady Gaga wouldn't call herself "a feminist" because she wasn't a "man-hater" or something like that. Not that I really care for her one way or another, but she's a very public figure perpetuating the idea and many young people share the opinion.
03/17/2012
Silverdrop Silverdrop
The main thing that, to me, makes feminists look bad is the mantra "every man is a potential rapist" and the idea that no woman would ever lie about being raped. Yes, some men are scumbag rapists, but most aren't. Just as some women are scumbag false-rape accusers, but most aren't.

It looks like feminism in America has a long way to go, when contraception as a civil right is still up for negotiation. I don't think it's as important here in England. Most of the big battles are over.
03/17/2012
Ciao. Ciao.
I'm a feminist!

I think, like every movement, feminism has had its share of bad press because of a handful of really radical feminists who don't really represent the aims of most feminists (who are purely interested in equality).
03/17/2012
underHim underHim
Most women especially do not like it when I tell them while my husband and I are absolute equals i an the type of person who is happy being barefoot pregnant and in the kitchen. I often defer to his judgement and this is what I want to do, not what I have to do.
03/17/2012
Beck Beck
I am a feminist, but I don't like to be labeled as anything. I share a lot of their values, but I am by no means an extreme feminist. I am not active in feminist activities, but I am not really active in anything. I should get more involved, maybe one day.
03/17/2012
Chirple Chirple
Quote:
Originally posted by Silverdrop
The main thing that, to me, makes feminists look bad is the mantra "every man is a potential rapist" and the idea that no woman would ever lie about being raped. Yes, some men are scumbag rapists, but most aren't. Just as some women are ...
It's been so awful recently with the birth control and abortion issues. I can't go on my Tumblr stream without wanting to punch a wall over it.

So much bullshit. I just saw a piece about Kansas considering allowing lying to women about the state of their pregnancies so that they don't "make bad choices". I mean, what the hell. What if they want to keep the baby but need to know how to prepare for a special needs child but you withold the information until the little sucker is born and they haven't had time to prepare ?

And lawmakers don't seem to understand how birth control works or why it's used. Lolol, I use it and I have never had PIV sex and probably never will, I need it for other important-to-my-health reasons. And not having babies is pretty important to a lot of people, too.


I think the "every man is a potential rapist" thing is a bit paranoid. Sure, it's true - but every woman could be, too. And any person on the street could kill you. It can be hard for a person living in a city where danger is real and I understand the paranoia it can breed and how hard it can be to trust.

My parents are extremely paranoid that I'll be raped / kidnapped / killed when I go on vacation and have to do a long drive by myself. I think parents pass down a lot of the fear with good intentions and it gets ground into you. I think a bigger city could be an extremely stressful environment in that regard - because the Bystander Effect and knowing that no one really "has your back" if something does happen.

Where was I going ? I dunno, it's bedtime >.>
03/17/2012
Chirple Chirple
Quote:
Originally posted by underHim
Most women especially do not like it when I tell them while my husband and I are absolute equals i an the type of person who is happy being barefoot pregnant and in the kitchen. I often defer to his judgement and this is what I want to do, not what I ...
I think it's silly when people worry about policing what makes others happy. There's no "wrong" choice if it's what works for you and everyone's happy.

I remember thinking about it a long time ago when I was starting high-school, when people were talking about stay-at-home moms and the like. Not everyone has the same path to a fulfilling life, and it's great if you can get there or close at all !
03/17/2012
Chirple Chirple
Quote:
Originally posted by Beck
I am a feminist, but I don't like to be labeled as anything. I share a lot of their values, but I am by no means an extreme feminist. I am not active in feminist activities, but I am not really active in anything. I should get more involved, ...
I wish I could be more active in my local LGBT group, but working nights has left me pretty isolated to anyone and anything that has a normal day schedule.
03/17/2012
- Kira - - Kira -
Feminism to me has always been a "women power!" type of movement. The feminists I have known always want to talk about how empowering it is to be female, how wonderful it is that we can birth children, and any other selection of things that make women oh so great. I'm happy to be a woman, but mostly because I can flirt my way out of things. So that's very anti-feminist of me, I suppose. I guess I'm setting the women's movement back every time I bat my eyelashes. That, however, is empowering to me.

In general, I believe that women should have the same amount of rights and ability to make choices as everyone else. I don't think that males and females are equal in all regards. Most guys aren't as nurturing (not saying all, but many) to children. Thus, women play the mother role. My husband works in construction (he operates a crane). They hire women sometimes and he says most of them can't handle the lifting requirements. He says the ones they hire to operate machinery are often no good at it. I'm sure some women would be great at that, but perhaps not as high of percent of women as men would be. Women tend to be more sensitive in general as well, and thus are better suited than men at things that require sensitivity and understanding. Again, not that men can't be or that women can't be heartless, just that there's a majority trend in the other direction. There's lots of differences that are pretty prominent between the two sexes. I think ignoring these differences for "equality" is silly. If you have a strength, play to that strength. If you're a sensitive person, trying to do a job or task that requires otherwise will be frustrating. And for the record, I'm less sensitive than many females I know.
03/17/2012
Ansley Ansley
My problem with feminism is usually brought to light when other women look down their nose at me over my choice to stay at home. And even more so when they realize that I don't have any children and have no intention or desire to have children. Boy, that really boils their blood.
03/17/2012
P'Gell P'Gell
I was a feminist in nearly every sense of the word. I was part of the "Second Founding" of Ms magazine. I yelled and protested. I consider myself "Post Feminist" now.

I do not like the way 2nd Wave Feminism treated mothers and children. All the talk is "feminism is allowing women to make the choices they choose." As long as those choices include wanting a high power career (not JOB, career) and putting one's children, if one even bothers to have them, into daycare. Also, the thought that most mothers feel their own children are an afterthought or simply an ornament to their otherwise busy lives, that someone else could raise just as well, while they are doing more "important" things with their time bothers the hell out of me. When I was home with my kids, NOTHING was more important.

Also, the biological specificity of breastfeeding is completely ignored by many 2nd Wave and 1st Wave feminists. The whole idea that men and women are interchangeable for all tasks irks me. We usually aren't. I can't carry a 180 man down a ladder to save him from a fire and my husband can't breastfeed an infant. That doesn't mean either of us is better than the other, just different.

Also, when my husband and I discovered the Dominant/submissive side to our relationship, a lot of my thinking changed.

I don't mind being home with kids, or working part time while they are in school. I like doing "female" things. I love my career, but if I had to, I'd give it up in a second if my children or my man needed me to.

I'm glad we have access to safe birth control (well, most of the time WHY are we still arguing about this issue in 2012?) and that some women are able to make a living wage (most are still underpaid, get on the stick, feminists, you've had 100 years, for heaven's sake!) and that we have the "right" to vote. But, so much of what life means to so many of us has been left behind in the race to be "just like men." I don't WANT to be a man. I want to be a happy woman!

I think a lot of what it means to be a woman was left out of the definition in 1st and 2nd Wave Feminism and I can't reconcile those contradictions with the way I want to live my life, as a woman, a wife, a mother and sometimes as a sub. Most heavy duty feminists don't get that at all. There aren't any 50/50 D/s or M/S relationships: that's a contradiction in terms.
03/17/2012
WhoopieDoo WhoopieDoo
Quote:
Originally posted by - Kira -
Feminism to me has always been a "women power!" type of movement. The feminists I have known always want to talk about how empowering it is to be female, how wonderful it is that we can birth children, and any other selection of things ...
I love this post right here ^

I don't consider myself a woman all of the time. If pressed to put a label on myself, gender-wise, I would identify as trigender. Even though I feel like I'm on a continuum between "man" and "woman", I recognize (and gladly accept) that I am female. I know that I don't have the ability to be as fast or strong as a physically fit male, because evolution has granted me the wide hips needed to birth giant-headed babies (while remaining bipedal) and take care of them, and there's nothing wrong with that.

I find empowerment in differences, as well, and could supposedly be considered anti-feminist in the manner that Kira depicted. Even though I'm only average-looking (based on conventional views of attractiveness here in America), I am confident that I could go out on any given night and never have to buy my own drinks, merely because I possess a vagina. Even though doing that would make me feel like I'm taking advantage of some desperate guy, that's amazing to me.

From a sexual standpoint especially, I'm THRILLED that I'm female. Multiple orgasms aside, it's much easier for me to pick and choose partners than, say, my husband.

As long as males/females can do a given job as well as the opposite sex, they should be treated as well and paid just as much, but there are just some jobs that are going to be biased toward one sex because of COMPLETELY NATURAL inherent differences. I try to see people as just that -people- who happen to have strengths and weaknesses bequeathed upon them by nature. Testicles = testosterone = probably stronger than me....will you help me lift this heavy object so that I don't throw my back out? Thanks. Ovaries = female = appealing to males..... can you lure that guy over here so that he can help me lift this heavy object so that I don't throw my back out? Thanks. There's nothing wrong with knowing that you are different from someone and using that to your advantage, in my opinion. It's a symbiotic relationship. It's using your resources. My guy wants me to fix his clothes all the time, which is easier for me with my smaller, agile, lady hands. He always gets the mail because the sun hates me. That has nothing to do with sex differences, but it's the same principal. Recognizing that you DO have weaknesses and it's okay to rely on other people to form a stronger, more efficient unit.
03/17/2012
Airen Wolf Airen Wolf
Quote:
Originally posted by Chirple
It greatly disturbs me to see feminist hate, especially on EF.

Many people are afraid to call themselves feminists because it's become a dirty word.

Who WOULDN'T want equality for men and women and everyone else ...
I'm a feminist in that I believe we should all stand up and claim our Woman-ness and be strong and proud to BE Women...and if we are Men then stand up and Be Men. I do not belive there can be true equality, there are things men do that I simply cannot but if another woman can then she should be allowed to benefit just as a man would. We should be able to decide for ourselves what we want to do, how we want to live and with whom. I don't believe it's a male politicians place to tell me what I can do with my own body, nor would I believe it is a woman politician's place to dictate to a man what he can and cannot do with his body. In these scary political times it is almost unsafe to NOT be a feminist...lest we disgrace all the women who gave up everything so that we could have this conversation, ya know?
03/17/2012
Ghost Ghost
I'm a militant feminist. People don't like it, often. Oh well. Poop to them!

Also, I don't believe in this false binaries crap.
03/17/2012
Missmarc Missmarc
Quote:
Originally posted by Chirple
It greatly disturbs me to see feminist hate, especially on EF.

Many people are afraid to call themselves feminists because it's become a dirty word.

Who WOULDN'T want equality for men and women and everyone else ...
I don't go out of my way to protest for equality. I do demand respect as a human being during day to day life.
03/17/2012
Incendiaire Incendiaire
Feminism too often seems to just be a guise for misandry.

I prefer egalitarianism.
03/17/2012
Mwar Mwar
There is a difference between being a feminist and femnazi. When I have a friend try and rank on it I tell them this, it lets them think.
03/17/2012
Tangles Tangles
Yes, it seems people automatically think "femnazi" when they hear the word "feminism" (because believing in equality/human rights/opposing oppression is similar to invading Poland?).

The loudest spoken feminists who dare call themselves feminists are generally the really radical ones, which would be why so many people tend to shy away from that label. I've heard alternatives; "humanist" and "womynist", but they all seem to be preaching the same basic things. Oppression is bad, don't marginalize people, equal work for equal pay, one sex is not superior to the other, along with many other similar underlying concepts.

There's a sticker on the back of my laptop that says, "This is what a feminist looks like," if that tells you anything about me personally.
03/18/2012
pasdechat pasdechat
I think that a lot--possibly most--people don't understand that there isn't one feminist "movement." There are huge differences of opinions within the feminist community over issues like whether gender differences exist, whether porn is degrading, whether child-rearing is detrimental to women's position, etc, etc. Granted, there are a few core beliefs that you probably have to subscribe to if you want to be taken seriously as a feminist--if you think that women shouldn't work outside the home, shouldn't be able to vote, shouldn't have access to birth control, and so on, it's hard to defend your beliefs from a feminist perspective. But there's no litmus test, and I think if people realized this, and realized just how much diversity there is within the feminist community, they might be less reluctant to apply the label to themselves.

I'll use myself as an example. It's only been within the last 2 to 3 years that I've become comfortable calling myself a feminist, and it was precisely for the reasons I've already mentioned. My opinions don't necessarily mesh with what's perceived as the feminist line. I enjoy porn, although I do think that some (but certainly not all) has a negative effect on the way women are viewed. I think there are gender differences between the sexes (for a really interesting perspective on this, I'd suggest reading up on the "ethics of care"), but that society tends to distort and exaggerate them. I think women should be allowed to work wherever they choose--whether that means at home or at a job--but I also think that men should take a more active role in child-rearing (many already do, but there's room for improvement). And so on. The point is, while I may not agree with the beliefs of everyone who calls herself (or himself) a feminist, I think it's important to use the word if you honestly feel that women's position in society needs some work.

To be honest, the absolute rancor you see directed at feminists surprises and upsets me. While I may not agree with hard-line "separatist" feminists, I personally know of very few of them, and I can't help but feel that there is a kneejerk and, to be blunt, sexist tendency to paint all women who speak out as "radicals." I've had interactions with members of men's rights groups that I went into in good faith, thinking that some of the issues they are concerned with (e.g. child-rearing) are pretty bound up in feminist concerns, and I was absolutely shouted down for being a man-hater, no matter what I said, or how calmly I said it. It was extremely disheartening.

In any case, I could talk about this for a LONG time, so I'll stop now. But if any one ever wants to chat about it, I'd be happy too--just PM me. I've volunteered with women's rights organizations and part of what I'm studying involves women's studies, so while I may not be an expert, I like to think I know my way around the subject fairly well
06/23/2012
Chilipepper Chilipepper
Eh, I'm a human being who works with what I have in a society that likes to label and sort because it's comfortable doing so.

Everyone considers me a "feminist" because I work, am an intellectual, use birth control, practice equal treatment among everyone, chose not to have children, aren't afraid of being independent, and willingly divorced my husband because the marriage wasn't working out - all because I happened to have been born female. A guy would be called a "Responsible Gentleman" for making the same choices.

I'd be considered a "slave to the patriarchy" by these same people if they knew I was a sub in the bedroom. Just that one facet of my personality seems to determine where I stand in their eyes.

Fuck 'em. I'm Me.
06/24/2012
cryinglightning86 cryinglightning86
Not the greatest fan of the fact that you assumed that no-one on here is a feminist (or at least, that's what your post title sounded like). I'm definitely a feminist (and a pretty radical one at that - if you want to label it as such), and I'd be willing to bet that there are plenty of others on here.

It is a shame that "feminist" is considered a dirty word, and I definitely think that a reclamation is in order. I don't understand what makes people so squeamish about the term. I suppose because people tend to think that feminism is this one, big, man-hating thing. Only ugly lesbians are feminists, I think I've heard that one before (absolutely ridiculous, of course). I've actually had people say to me, "Oh, don't call yourself that," when I mentioned that I call myself a feminist.

I have theories as to why this is, or why there's hatred against feminism in general. But I don't pretend to fully understand it. I don't think it's possible to. Just so long as we continue to work against it, as we would against any other sort of issue that holds back a given people group.
06/24/2012
Sundae Sparkles Sundae Sparkles
Quote:
Originally posted by Errant Venture
I don't recall anyone on here being against feminism. I recall people being against militant feminism, as you point out, but not actual feminism.
I agree... Im all about equality... but it works both ways
06/24/2012
<3BF <3BF
I'm a feminist. I know guys usually don't use that term so I would like to point out that I'm not trying to be ironic there but I wholeheartedly support feminism, ie equal rights, pay, social standing for both men and women.
06/24/2012
solitudinarian solitudinarian
Quote:
Originally posted by Incendiaire
Feminism too often seems to just be a guise for misandry.

I prefer egalitarianism.
I agree. I realize that there are different types of feminism, but by calling myself a feminist I am not making this distinction.
08/07/2012
SassySam SassySam
I have no problem calling myself a feminist.
02/08/2013
dks210 dks210
I'm a feminist, and agree with you.
02/21/2013
MrWill MrWill
I'm all for equal rights. When a woman commits the same crime as a man and gets the exact same punishment, then I will be happy.



I can think of at least 3 huge stories in the last few years when a woman went absolutely off her rocker and did some horrible stuff and only got a couple years.

A man in the exact same situation would have received multiple life sentences.



My point is this: You want equality, take equality across the board.
02/21/2013
Total posts: 29
Unique posters: 25