The New Intimacy

Yeah, I'm gonna go there . . .

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Contributor: Elaira Elaira
I've been around here for about a year now and just returned from a leave of absence due to some personal issues and I noticed things had changed since I had left.

I don't want to come off the wrong way, but it seems like things aren't what they used to be around here and this makes me somewhat sad. I used to spend so much time in the forums here because it was interesting and engaging. There was always something fun to talk about. There was substance and everyone seemed to have a ball.

Now, though, every time I peek at what's going on there's really not much of that anymore. I'm trying to come off in the best way I can without sounding like I'm sitting here and bitching about this, but it seems like those things I used to enjoy about this community have been watered down by things that we have all taken notice of in the past. Even though it was an issue then, it seems like it's grown. People are creating several threads one right after the next. I get the same "Thanks! I look forward to trying this!" comment on several of my reviews from the same person even if I wrote a scathing review about something, and it's rare that I see something in my comments other than "Thanks". It seems like it's a points thing, and that's a rather difficult issue here.

I know we've had discussions about this in the past that had us all in a tizzy, but is there anyone else out there who has noticed this? What can we do to make this community more substantial like it has been in the past? I'm not pissed off or trying to rant. I just want to try to save what many people appreciate about being here.
03/29/2012
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Contributor: Elaira Elaira
And from the Expectations of Conduct in regards to point farming:

"Numerous threads and posts being created that offer nothing of value to the forums. While we do encourage questions about products being asked on the forums, we ask that the questions first be researched on the website for an answer and then asked via the forums if a satisfactory answer was not found. Also, a search within the forums should be done to ensure that another thread with the same specific subject has not already been created in a similar fashion."

How can this be enforced but still be fair to everyone? What constitutes point farming and what doesn't? What are the boundaries?
03/29/2012
Contributor: underHim underHim
I know there is alot of repetition in the threads and I have only been on here a couple weeks. Search the threads for Ben wa balls or anal beads and you will find so many identical threads. It does get a little stale.
03/29/2012
Contributor: Gary Gary
Change is inevitable. However, the problems the community has now are being addressed. Please be patient. Please continue to be an example for newer contributors to see, by posting quality threads & leaving quality comments. We are always here working on things, and we would love to your ideas & suggestion as well.
03/29/2012
Contributor: Beck Beck
Quote:
Originally posted by Elaira
And from the Expectations of Conduct in regards to point farming:

"Numerous threads and posts being created that offer nothing of value to the forums. While we do encourage questions about products being asked on the forums, we ask that ... more
I just submitted a message to Stormy that she is planning on passing around. I have notice the same things you are talking about. I have made some suggestions about only allowing so many posts by each member per week that is below the number of post allowed for points in that week. (In case that wasn't clear: Say you are allowed to make 5 threads for points a day, well times the week that is 30 different post, well the number should be like 10. Aside from the administration.) This has been going on since about the time you left actually and it has been getting worse.

The thanks comments on reviews are never going to go away. Not every review has questions that need to be asked. You should just take it as a good indication that your review did not lead to questions.
03/29/2012
Contributor: Ansley Ansley
Quote:
Originally posted by Beck
I just submitted a message to Stormy that she is planning on passing around. I have notice the same things you are talking about. I have made some suggestions about only allowing so many posts by each member per week that is below the number of post ... more
The thanks comments on reviews are never going to go away. Not every review has questions that need to be asked. You should just take it as a good indication that your review did not lead to questions.

Indeed.
03/29/2012
Contributor: Kindred Kindred
The"thanks" comment is annoying but honestly is harmless and in the long run only helps us.

The forums are a different issue. I think it's just a result of the community growing so rapidly. Some are point farmers, but some are also newer members of the community that are simply excited and in love with the points system. Try to remember how awesome we each thought the point system was at first. I'm sure we all did activities to maximize our points that today we would probably find annoying. Consider that most of the concerns voiced are from seasoned contributors. Why? Because we have the wisdom of experience. We don't care so much about points anymore.

The only solution I see is to remove points from the forums. The downside is that the forums may become totally inactive except for a few. Remember, the points are an incentive to get people involved in the community and forums. Although the spam is annoying, I'd guess that quite a few current members active in the forums first came because of the points but stayed for the community.
03/29/2012
Contributor: P'Gell P'Gell
Quote:
Originally posted by Beck
I just submitted a message to Stormy that she is planning on passing around. I have notice the same things you are talking about. I have made some suggestions about only allowing so many posts by each member per week that is below the number of post ... more
I agree there may need to be a limit on starting threads per day or per week. However, responding to threads is a different story. Some days, I go over my "point number" on responses, just because.... I have a lot to say. (I rarely respond with things like, "Um, it depends." to a thread that poses a specific question.)

Other days, I may not post at all (worked like a dog yesterday, all over Chicago, came home exhausted, and let my 12 year old show me funny videos on YouTube about baby animals instead of coming over to Eden. )

So, maybe a limit on starting threads, but on interesting days, no limit should be placed on responding them them, just a limit on points. We already have that. I've never gone over points on starting threads, but I don't start that many so.....

I also think a lot of times when we are away, (kind of like summer vacation from school) we forget a lot of the less than great stuff and only remember the fun. So, when reality hits when we return... well, that's the root of nostalgia.
03/29/2012
Contributor: Adriana Ravenlust Adriana Ravenlust
I think that a limit on starting threads would be good. Specifically, a longer TIME limit.
03/29/2012
Contributor: Beck Beck
Quote:
Originally posted by P'Gell
I agree there may need to be a limit on starting threads per day or per week. However, responding to threads is a different story. Some days, I go over my "point number" on responses, just because.... I have a lot to say. (I rarely respond ... more
Oh yes, I meant starting them not commenting on them. Sorry if that was not clear.
03/29/2012
Contributor: P'Gell P'Gell
Quote:
Originally posted by Kindred
The"thanks" comment is annoying but honestly is harmless and in the long run only helps us.

The forums are a different issue. I think it's just a result of the community growing so rapidly. Some are point farmers, but some are ... more
Right. Also, not responding to "spammy" threads will cause them to move down and fall off the visual board quickly.

I am not crazy about removing points for using the forums, like you said, it may really reduce forum usage (and that's one of the things that makes Eden such a cool place) and IMO, it may cause actual "spammy" reviews. I'd rather ignore a spammy thread, and have it drop off the board, than have to deal with bagillions of poorly written, rushed reviews written by people who are only doing it to get points.
03/29/2012
Contributor: Kindred Kindred
Quote:
Originally posted by P'Gell
Right. Also, not responding to "spammy" threads will cause them to move down and fall off the visual board quickly.

I am not crazy about removing points for using the forums, like you said, it may really reduce forum usage (and ... more
The problem is that people don't let the spammy reviews drop. People respond and vote to get points themselves. It's a never ending circle.
03/29/2012
Contributor: Beck Beck
Quote:
Originally posted by P'Gell
Right. Also, not responding to "spammy" threads will cause them to move down and fall off the visual board quickly.

I am not crazy about removing points for using the forums, like you said, it may really reduce forum usage (and ... more
I think you are right about that too. It would just lead to more spamming else were. And if we slowly take away points because of spam, we will lose all the points slowly but surely.
03/29/2012
Contributor: Ansley Ansley
Great conversation everyone! I know Beck has seen it, but just in case anyone else wants to add their two cents in, Gary started a thread asking for suggestions on how to handle this whole situation. We're interested in finding out how you would change the Expectations of Conduct to reduce spamming.
03/29/2012
Contributor: Voir Voir
Whenever I first came like a week or so ago, I noticed some of the older users seemed a lot more close but most of the threads were just... not really discussion? I was hoping for a more involved community and was at first kinda disappointed that it all just seemed to be a post and run thing instead of threads actually rolling with conversation. And those that DID were older and had since been abandoned.

Buttt maybe it could change >_> with a post limit, I was surprised there was a max of 5 discussions a day. I was thinking (before checking) it would be like one or something. That way the max for a week is 7. One discussion a day, maybe 3 or so polls a week, because let's face it there's only so much that can be done with a poll XD and if someone really wants to know they'll post the poll/discussion regardless of points or not.
03/29/2012
Contributor: Elaira Elaira
This is all what I missed about the community and what made me appreciate it so much. In the mess of all of those spammy posts and stuff, there are still people here who really care about this. I was a little nervous about posting this because sometimes these things cause an uproar and we all huff and puff over things, but we're really listened to as a community and our concerns are taken seriously. We all look out for each other and do our part. All of this has really restored my faith here.

03/29/2012
Contributor: Breas Breas
Quote:
Originally posted by Kindred
The"thanks" comment is annoying but honestly is harmless and in the long run only helps us.

The forums are a different issue. I think it's just a result of the community growing so rapidly. Some are point farmers, but some are ... more
I agree about the "thanks" comments. I mean, for the most part, that is usually what I get on my reviews or some sort of variation of "thank you". I don't mind it though. I mean, if I covered everything in my review where a person who has read it doesn't have any in-depth questions for me then, YAY! The whole "thank-you" commenting on reviews has been discussed so many times. So many people get irritated and annoyed by these types of comments but I've never really understood why.

I'm not trying to come across as jerky or whatever but it's mind boggling to me. No one has to take the time to even say anything in the comments so the fact that a person took the time to say "hey thanks for the good review" or whatever it may be, I feel a sense of appreciation rather than "grrrrr, why is that all they said?!" Know what I mean?

I think for the people who don't like comments on their reviews should be able to block all comments completely. If a person has a question about that review then they can just message the reviewer about it. Me though? I'll take all the comments, regardless of their size (now, a random emoticon is another story lol).
03/29/2012
Contributor: P'Gell P'Gell
Quote:
Originally posted by Kindred
The problem is that people don't let the spammy reviews drop. People respond and vote to get points themselves. It's a never ending circle.
Yep, this happens. I was on a forum some years ago, and we made a concerted effort (the people who cared) not to respond to overly "spammy" posts. (One cute post is one thing, 4 or more threads started in 2 minutes is something else.) Eventually it worked. I mean, they still occurred, but it got better.

(We are also using the word "spam" in the wrong context, but it isn't a big deal. "SPAM" means a large number of emails sent to many addresses in order to scam someone or sell things people don't want and things sent by 'bots. The word we are really looking for is "trolling." But, now that word has been co-opted to mean "attacking or insulting other posters." Sorry, my OCD wouldn't let me not post this. )
03/29/2012
Contributor: P'Gell P'Gell
Quote:
Originally posted by Voir
Whenever I first came like a week or so ago, I noticed some of the older users seemed a lot more close but most of the threads were just... not really discussion? I was hoping for a more involved community and was at first kinda disappointed that it ... more
By "7 a week" are you talking about responding to posts or starting new threads?

Seven a week limit for responding would pretty much destroy the forum, I think. But, limiting starting threads to a certain number (am not sure what that number is, though) would be a good idea. And not just ending the points when you reach the number, the actual inability to start new threads.
03/29/2012
Contributor: js250 js250
Quote:
Originally posted by Elaira
This is all what I missed about the community and what made me appreciate it so much. In the mess of all of those spammy posts and stuff, there are still people here who really care about this. I was a little nervous about posting this because ... more
Good!! Keep your faith in EF, most of us still love and care about the site and keeping it good for everyone. No huffing or puffing is a good thing...especially after a few of the fires that were put out last week. lol!

Glad you are back and maybe we needed you to keep us in line (wink), you know how it can be....When all is said and done though, we do work together to keep this a great place, there are no many other places that could really learn a lot from Eden!!!
03/29/2012
Contributor: Elaira Elaira
Quote:
Originally posted by Breas
I agree about the "thanks" comments. I mean, for the most part, that is usually what I get on my reviews or some sort of variation of "thank you". I don't mind it though. I mean, if I covered everything in my review where a ... more
I just really like to read when people actually comment on the review instead of thanking me for it. You know, something interesting that furthers the discussion. Even if it's something along the lines of "I've been wanting to try this! It's a shame it's so ______" or "Wow, now I feel like I need this!" It's something that's always appreciated because I like to engage in silly banter about things.
03/30/2012
Contributor: Adriana Ravenlust Adriana Ravenlust
Quote:
Originally posted by P'Gell
Yep, this happens. I was on a forum some years ago, and we made a concerted effort (the people who cared) not to respond to overly "spammy" posts. (One cute post is one thing, 4 or more threads started in 2 minutes is something else.) ... more
Yea, spam is the RIGHT word here, P'gell. You seem to be a bit confused about it. Trollers are more the type who post completely unrelated things, start fights and flame wards and insult, etc.
04/02/2012