What Counts as Pornographic?

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What Counts as Pornographic?

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Contributor: wildorchid wildorchid
So last night I stumbled upon an article on the Lelo website that made me think "This would be a great topic on Eden"!

Basically a few months ago the French government shut down a "love shop" that sold high end luxury sensual items because it violated a French law that says nothing pornographic can be sold within 200 metres of a school site.

The French faction of Lelo is a little confused and is calling for clarification on what the French government counts as pornography. Their opinion as a high end luxury brand, is that they have never portrayed or endorsed any pornographic content and have in fact been sold in several mainstream stores throughout the world because their designs are the opposite of phallic.

Anyway, my question for Edenites is; after reading the article, how do you guys feel? What counts as pornographic for you? Any other comments?

Article Link

Please read the article, it's got more information in it. And let's all remember to respect others' opinions please. Let's have an awesome discussion.
04/02/2012
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Contributor: wildorchid wildorchid
So my personal opinion:

Pornographic content usually comes from the packaging to me. Naked people in suggestive positions and the like are what I would consider pornographic. I do not think that high end brands like Lelo are pornographic or promote pornographic content. I appreciate that Lelo is sticking up for high end stores without bashing the law entirely because I do think that children of certain ages should be kept away from sexual/sensual things until certain ages or when life inevitably deems them ready. However, on the other hand if they have to be exposed to a love shop due its proximity to their schools, I would rather it be a high end one.

In my opinion high end brands promote a certain sophistication, classiness and respect to sex that I would like my children to appreciate as well.

However, if I had been the shop owner, I probably would have done my homework and tried to find a different location for my store and not risked having it so close to a school. That's too expensive of a venture to risk getting shut down.
04/02/2012
Contributor: Kindred Kindred
Quote:
Originally posted by wildorchid
So last night I stumbled upon an article on the Lelo website that made me think "This would be a great topic on Eden"!

Basically a few months ago the French government shut down a "love shop" that sold high end luxury ... more
The link doesn't work directly but here is a copy of the article:

LELO Speaks Out: Luxury Intimate Lifestyle Objects Cannot Be “Pornographic”
March 30, 2012

Last month, French lawmakers declared that a “love shop” in Paris, which only carried high-end intimate lifestyle products, violated a decades-old law in France that bans the sale of pornographic materials within 200 meters of a school site.

While we at LELO do not object to the facet of the law that shields adolescents from contact with obscene materials, the company calls for clarification of what can be appropriately categorized as “pornography,” since a significant segment of the population purchases intimate goods for enhancement of their private or romantic lives. As the world’s leading provider of such intimate lifestyle products, LELO feels very strongly about maintaining a clear distinction between sensuality and obscenity.

As LELO France PR Manager Roxane Mek says: “LELO is the most striking example of the enormous disparity between specialty intimate lifestyle products and prurient materials. We have always communicated messages of luxury and personal wellbeing—never of pornography or obscenity.”

Furthermore, LELO is a Red Dot award-winning firm, internationally recognized by top design experts for excellence in product design. The company launched in 2003 due to an absence of high quality construction and design aesthetic in the adult market. LELO “Pleasure Objects” introduced the idea that high-quality, beautifully designed massagers could exist opposite to the plastic buzzers and life-like phalluses that once characterized the industry.

Never has LELO portrayed any pornographic content or encouraged such collaborations in the 10 years of its history. LELO has been showcased in Fuori Salone in Milan and enjoyed a run at the 2009 Cannes Film Festival, where our commercial spot for the LUXE line of 24-karat gold plated massagers was shown on movie screens throughout the city. LELO products are also sold in mainstream outlets around the world, including state-owned Swedish pharmacy Apoteket, Walgreens and Brookstones in the United States, as well as online retailers Amazon.com and Drugstore.com.

According to Roxane, “LELO stands by love shops, which have no associations with vulgarities. Love shops cater to individuals and couples looking to spice up their intimate lives–sexuality of any sort does not necessarily equate to pornography, and it’s crucial that here in France, we distinguish the boundaries of the erotic and the obscene.”
04/02/2012
Contributor: wildorchid wildorchid
Jeepers you are quick! Thanks you Kindred and sorry everybody!
04/02/2012
Contributor: Kindred Kindred
I think it depends upon what the French government defines as pornography. To me, pornography involves a graphic depiction of genitalia or intercourse. A sex toy in and of itself is not pornographic if it is not realistic in appearance. The danger of associating pornography with a device is that leaves the definition to further expansion. For example, are condoms then considered pornographic? What about body massagers that are used for masturbating but were originally designed as deep tissue massagers. Even some medical devices could fall under this interpretation. The decision potentially starts us on a slippery slope.
04/02/2012
Contributor: wildorchid wildorchid
And I think that's the point Lelo was trying to make. Unfortunately the article is a little vague and tends to do a bit of Lelo promoting...
04/02/2012
Contributor: Beck Beck
Quote:
Originally posted by Kindred
I think it depends upon what the French government defines as pornography. To me, pornography involves a graphic depiction of genitalia or intercourse. A sex toy in and of itself is not pornographic if it is not realistic in appearance. The danger ... more
Great points.
04/02/2012
Contributor: unfulfilled unfulfilled
That sounds crazy. For me anything pornographic would include nudity or exposing genitals. I do not consider Lelo pleasure objects to be pornographic. My husband does not want me to get any phallic toys because he's insecure so I know I can count on Lelo for an insertable toy that won't look like a cock.
04/02/2012
Contributor: Ciao. Ciao.
The line between sensual/sexual/erotic/ pornographic is always a fuzzy one when it comes to legal regulation, unfortunately.

As far as I'm concerned a Lelo toy is no more or less "pornographic" than a bra and I would have no problem seeing it in a mainstream shop that could possibly be viewed by minors.
04/02/2012
Contributor: PeaceToTheMiddleEast PeaceToTheMiddleEast
Well dang if they consider Lelo toys pornographic there and don't want the shops by schools. They need to come here to Ohio. There is one a block from my son's school and then you have Spencer's in the mall which is a couple block away and there are many schools around that area.

I do not consider these to be pornographic at all.
04/02/2012
Contributor: ToyTimeTim ToyTimeTim
I think part of the problem here is when the law was made, "violated a decades-old law" puts us back at least twenty years (probably more). How many sex toys did you see back then WITHOUT a naked person on it? While I understand the law, I think there should be some give here. I bet there are a tons of laws like this just based on the old way of thinking about sex toy use.

My question is, how was the toy displayed (Front window with a big sign that says "SEX TOY "?) and are these under-aged kids allowed in the store? I bet not.
04/07/2012
Contributor: badk1tty badk1tty
Quote:
Originally posted by wildorchid
So last night I stumbled upon an article on the Lelo website that made me think "This would be a great topic on Eden"!

Basically a few months ago the French government shut down a "love shop" that sold high end luxury ... more
I see both sides. As a parent, I'd be a little annoyed if there was a sex shop that close to school, because it seems almost as if it's marketed there. On the other side, if it's not pussies in the window, or dildos hanging from strings where my kids can see it, and it's very discreet, I don't see the harm.
04/08/2012